Unknowing divers endangering kids

[DandyDon]

Scubafool - you did good.

On SB, tho - after a point is made, then defended, I find it's good to find a place to shrug my shoulders and move on...

Hang in there dude. :14:

 

[eandiver]

off topic but it was funny walking out of the spring with my Sherwood Genesis Steel 80 in hand and having another diver ask me why I was diving with a pony bottle.

 

[GreenDiverDown]

Scubafool - you did good.

On SB, tho - after a point is made, then defended, I find it's good to find a place to shrug my shoulders and move on...

Hang in there dude. :14:

Wise advice...but difficult to follow!

 

[DandyDon]

Wise advice...but difficult to follow!

I know, I know, I know...

 

[scubafool]

I just don't want someone to read this thread & think "Gee, this isn't really that dangerous, nothing to really worry about." As I said, I could care less what others think of ME, I started this thread hoping to spread information around & help others. If that makes me a FOOL, I already have experience with that, LOL.

 

[debdiver]

I seem to recall a number of years ago, a "Dad" diving in Catalina I think it was, and he let his uncertified son breathe off his snorkel. Anyone remeber this? The kid held his breath and damaged his lungs, collapsed or some thing. Don't think the kid died, but it was a big story for a while. (OK, perhaps that was 15 years ago??)

Another thing I remember, because I was there, La Jolla Shores about 10 years ago... I was with an Advanced class and the life guards told us we could not go into the water, they were doing a search for a missing diver. Some idiot had just finished his OW class and told his cousin not to bother with the class, it's so easy HE would teach him how to dive. Yeah, good idea?!! (insert irony here...) The cousin ran out of air at 90 feet, they went to share air, the cousin didn't hook up and got lost. The vis wasn't that great that day. I think they found the body the next day.

Perhaps common sense isn't so common.

 

[Drewski]

Having certified more than 50 kids in the 12 to 15 y/o range over a period of more than 5 years, here are some thoughts:

First, and most importantly, there is NO way you can control a kid just wearing JUST a wetsuit, regardless of the buoyancy issue. To hold onto him underwater and exert SAFE control, you need STRAPS. That means a BCD. If the kid panicked and shot for the surface, he'd be gone before you could stop him. Second, mixing free diving and SCUBA is risky at best because even adults have problems remembering when or if they are supposed to exhale, so I hope this wasn't the case here...

I had a 13 y/o panic during a buddy breathing drill at 30 FT and shoot for the surface obviously holding his breath. In this type scenario, the first priority is to STOP and regain control of the ascent followed by forced exhalation. I had one hand on the kid's straps, the other hand dumping my BCD and the kid's BCD air and my knee in the kid's gut forcing him to exhale. We successfully made the surface without injury, but those types of scenarios are never easy.

Third, YES, allowing kids to experience underwater breathing is a great idea, but I'd always start in standing depth water or less, never went deeper than 8 FT and always did it in a pool. Again, CONTROL is key, so you better have that figured out before you attempt it.

Finally, yep, I'd talk to the parent afterward also, not so much to "bust" him, but certainly to inform him of the risks. Doing it in a "positive" fashion is the way to go here...

So, ScubaFool, I got your back brother....

 

[GrierHPharmD]

Well, I remember the (uncertified) dad who took his (uncertified) 14 y/o son out for last year's lobster mini-season at Deerfield Beach and surfaced to clear his mask, leaving the kid with 34 pounds of lead in his belt and no training. Dad got swept away in current, couldn't re-locate the kid, and the child drowned after he breathed out all of his air waiting for Daddy...

Scubafool, you're right to be concerned and to mention it to the father. As trained divers, we have a duty to try and educate people who add to the public image of our sport as a reckless, extreme sport.

Good job!
-Grier

 

[friscuba]

Id say he reacted irrationally and over the top. By all means have a word outside the water and ask if its ok. However coming to a busy message board and villifying the person involved (lack of understanding of gas laws, placing a child in danger) without ONCE bothering to obtain a single fact as to either persons level of qualification just shows hes trying despreately to highlight himself as some sort of hero and also hinting hes thinking hes far more qualified to know more than these people (despite never bothering to find out any details).

A quiet word to check its ok and nothing more is fine, bringing it public and then making accusations without bothering to have a single fact to back it up is ridiculous and totally wrong.

You seem to be villifying fool for jumping to assumptions, yet you are automatically jumping to the assumption that the kid was certified.

Fool approached them and said it may be none of his business, but... and the guys response apparently never gave any indication that the kid was certified. I would say it is highly likely that fool was dead on with his actions.

Erring on the side of caution on this case may have smartened up the parent, couldn't hurt if the kid was certified, but hopefully helped if the kid wasn't.

This is a valid concern, even IF both were certified. As Stephen Ash pointed out, lots of certified divers DON"T think about such things all the time. Certificaion really only implies competancy, it does not ensure it. I could pretty much guarantee if you were to watch every certified diver who posts on this board put their gear together, you'd find that a sizeable portion would have to take their time and really think about how to mount their BCDs and hook thier regulators on their tank and lp inflators - it's not automatic for everyone, you can't assume that breathing out on an impromptu ascent would be automatic for everyone, even though it was taught in class.

IF the kid was not certified, then the father was definitly risking the kid's life.

later,

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

Are you sure the said boy wasnt qualified in one way? He may have just gone down to use the octopus to have a look and could have been a qualified diver.

Ive donated air to a snorkeller before now (knowing them well and are far more qualified a diver than myself).

Regardless of the boy being qualified or not, it is never a good idea to donate air to someone who has no way of controlling their ascent and this kid did not have a way. I would hope that if the kid is a qualified diver that he would have been trained about the dangers of an uncontrolled ascent and what not to do. This can go different ways depending on how think the wetsuit is, how trained the kid is, how trained the adult is, etc. As a general rule though, it is not a good idea to donate air to a snorkeler who has a wetsuit on and no weights to slow their ascent.