leisurepro worth it?

[yknot]

Has anyone experienced difficulty getting warranty work done at an authorized dealer other than the one thru which gear was purchased? I gather from what I see posted on this board that there is nothing forcing a retailer to service anything. I can sympathize with an LDS in respects to distributor's rules. I would imagine that the threat of losing your Scubapro account for failing to comply with the rules is pretty frightening. Incidently, who is really behind these practices? Is it the actual manufacturer or are there regional/ national distributors involved? As an example, in Michigan, if a new car dealership (other than the one I bought thru) refused to perform warranty service on my new car they could be subject to penalties, I would suppose, as stiff as loss of their franchise. These penalties would be imposed by their parent manufacturer, not the state. On the other hand, all of the new car dealerships in my area maintain EXACTLY the same hours of operation. Apparently this monopolistic, unethical and anti consumer type of behavior is OK with both the State of Michigan and with all of the manufacturers as no legal challenge to this practice has ever been sucessful. Has anyone researched scuba industry practices from a manufacturer's stand point? Would a manufacturer respond to a boycott threat? I don't think any of the larger manufacturers could survive without the US market. I keep wondering why we would continue to buy a brand that withheld warranties because of where it was purchased.

 

[Scuba]

All businesses are susceptible to a boycott of their product.

I think there is a great deal of apathy and acceptance of current practices by much of the diving public. After all, this has been the standard way of doing business in this industry. I hear divers often go out of their way to justify high prices and poor customer service with the excuse of : be gratefull we have local dives boats from which to dive and local scuba retailers from which to shop.

Many new comers to our sport are now used to better pricing competition and better service. These new divers will increasingly demand more from the diving industry, and those who continue to subsidise the old ways will decrease in numbers. There is change underway as an increasing number of divers make many of their purchases "online". I guess one can say this is having the same affect as a boycott of local dealers.

I think the manufacturers have or are starting to realize the need to include and accept internet commerce. I guess its only natural that they also try and hold down the old fort (LDS) model as long as they can from a profit margin perspective.

 

[yknot]

Scuba- When we buy online (at any price) a brand that is known to "Outlaw" online sales and withhold warranties, what penalty do these manufacturers pay? In essence, they sold a product. They also now have you on the hook for parts, at your expense. This isn't another plea to support your LDS but a call for all of us as consumers to demand better. If Scubapro went out of business tomorrow is anyone here going to quit diving? Someone on this board needs to found an international club for divers and diver's rights. No manufacturers, no training agencies, etc.-just divers. Look at what orgs. like AARP have done. I bet some businesses quake at the thought of being an AARP target. The businesses that make a living from scuba need all of us more than we need any one of them. Where do I send my dues? Genesis?

 

[Genesis]

But you never know!

I think the first thing to do is to raise holy hades with your AGs in each of your states.

These policies aren't just a "bad idea". In many cases they appear to be flatly against the law - which makes them immediate fodder for the AGs to go chase...

I've made the calls and sent the letters. The more people do this, the faster it gets noticed.

 

[yknot]

AG's are only one track. I'm not sure about your state but this is an election year in Michigan. You pander to voters here by insisting on how blue your collar is (not carribean or cobalt blue either.) I don't think a sport whose adherents are probably of above average income will exactly gain anyones sympathy in my state. How about this fantasy headline "Multimillionare drowns. Unwarrentied regulator still in his mouth." Is it bringing tears to your eyes? How about this one: "In the most successful grass roots consumer boycott of a recreational gear manufacturer distributor in US history, Aqualung agreed to send regulator repair kits to every household in America along with an apology for past crimes. In return, the World Wide Scuba Divers Association agreed to temporarily halt legal action." We don't need the government involved in what we should be able to do ourselves.

 

[Scuba]

yknot,

When we buy online (at any price) a brand that is known to "Outlaw" online sales and withhold warranties, what penalty do these manufacturers pay?

"at any price", Possibly none, they may even gain in terms of lower operating cost. Some who buys online at the same or higher cost compared to an LDS, and in return receives no manufacturer warranty, is probably uninformed or not looking out for his best interests. (possibly)

At a lower cost.

Their high margin sales diminish ( to LDS's ). If the level of disruption is high enough, the LDS's start closing down, further cutting into fat margins and probably cutting into overall volume. If enough customers become dissatisfied with warranty issues they will apply pressure on the manufacturers directly with their complaints. In addition when the word gets out that X manufacturer does'nt stand behind their product, sales diminish.

This is all taking place now.

Aside from that I agree with what you say. I, for one, will not patronize someone who does not stand behind their product, a dealer who is not competitive overall - price and service. There are too many choices out there of comparable quality.

 

[zboss]

Why do you think there are so many PADI courses and course materials that just keep going up and up in price as you "ascend" in experience?

Also - why do you think PADI or your LDS makes you "tear our your quiz pages"? It's so you can't give your book to someone else to use... or sell it on e-bay.

The average dive store is going to make a lot of money off the new diver because they don't know simple things like what size BC or exposure protection to wear. However - I think it is wise for experienced divers buying off of the internet.

 

[Genesis]

In fact, I turned in my answers on a WORD document.

My books are all unmarked and in new condition.

 

[grouchyturtle]

As I said before, when I'm ready to buy I'll probably get the important stuff (life support) from my LDS. that way I can try it out first and hopefully they'll do maintanence for me.

But other things I'll get from LeisurePro, like wetsuits, weights, etc. Their prices are just ridiculously cheaper.

Here is LeisurePro's warranty info.

Warranty Information We are not authorized dealers of some Manufacturers, and some of the products may not be accompanied by the manufactures Warranty valid in the United States, However we provide in such instances our own Warranty, which offers equal or greater protection, For a Copy of our Warranty Card, Click Here.

You can see it here
http://s1059kxm.leisurepro.com/weba...Pro/macros/faq.d2w/report#warrantyinformation

And here is a copy of their warranty card. Unfortunately it's a low res jpg, so it's impossible to read any of the terms
http://s1059kxm.leisurepro.com/weba...ecMacro/LeisurePro/macros/warranty.d2w/report

So here we go:
1 - Has anyone hear bought from LeisurePro, who can maybe tell us some of these terms? Do they really include a warranty that is equal to or greater than the manufacturer.

2 - I got the impression from some of these earlier posts that people have had problems with the LDS servicing gear bought from them? If so why not buy everything from LeisurePro? Much cheaper prices, better warranty than manufacturer, if you have to send something out for repair anyway, it really doesn't matter where you bought it. It seams the only benefit of buying from the LDS is being able to possibly try things first?

3 - I'm sending that letter to everyone I know, so we can make revisions and send out our own copies. What is the AG though?

 

[Genesis]

Look up your state government phone numbers and addresses...

They are the people at a state level that are responsible for anti-competitive behavior - the FTC is on a federal level.