This morning in Egypt ...

[berndo]

You've missed 90% of my points in your effort to focus on the plight of the 'poor Egyptians'.

No, I know what you mean. It's just not realistic. They have a million issues that need fixing ... changing boat design for tourists, hiring some safety inspector or government regulation isn't even on that list.
You sound a little naiv, sorry.

The Red Sea needs less boats, less divers, higher standards and higher prices.

Less boats and less jobs in that area is a horrible idea, for obvious reason.

Their owners and management need to lose money and their staff need to leave or starve.

You should tell them directly when your there next time. Where that lives on a boat and works as a deck hand leave to exactly? Don't you see how arrogant you sound. You some dude from canada with enough time an money to fly to another continent to go scuba diving for fun saying dirt poor kids should just get another job or starve? Really?

They are the boat owners and boat designers and they need to be held to account even if their is some collateral damage to the industry and the workers therein.

Held to account by whom or what?

 

[DandyDon]

Held to account by whom or what?

Me, for one, a paying traveler who refuses to go there because of the dangers inherit.

 

[berndo]

Me, for one, a paying traveler who refuses to go there because of the dangers inherit.

Good luck with that.

 

[Mike Walker]

Less boats and less jobs in that area is a horrible idea, for obvious reason.

I said less boats. No where did I say less jobs.

You should tell them directly when your there next time. Where that lives on a boat and works as a deck hand leave to exactly? Don't you see how arrogant you sound. You some dude from canada with enough time an money to fly to another continent to go scuba diving for fun saying dirt poor kids should just get another job or starve? Really?

If an operator kills all their customers (or enough to make others think twice before booking) their workers also starve. This isn't a utopia.

If you choose to donate your life so that an Egyptian family doesn't go hungry that is your prerogative.

But, as you say: I can fly anywhere. They have to compete for my business.

Held to account by whom or what?

Smart, informed customers who value their lives no longer giving those operations money. And if that, in turn, results in temporary harm to their workers and their families who are no longer earning... perhaps the leadership of those operations find themselves experiencing some more 'direct' justice.

 

[berndo]

I said less boats. No where did I say less jobs.

Fewer boats means fewer jobs.

 

[Nick_Radov]

Untill we have a comprehinsive reporting system, mostly directed at being able to self reprt DCS combined with a universally accepted "Report Form," as an example, combined with dive computers that can actually export relevant dive factors, as a further exsample. A reporting system that can also track these kinds of locations and the bad actors, it seems these kinds of incidents are just going to continue as well as the drive aways.

DAN has an incident reporting system.

Diving Incident Reporting System

When data is collected on injuries related to breath-hold and scuba diving, fatalities and injuries will be reduced, making the sport safer.

dan.org

We should all use it for any safety incident where we are directly involved, including incidents in foreign countries. But I am skeptical about the value of self reporting DCS. More divers die from boating mishaps, sudden medical events, and drowning than from DCS. The data from recreational diving profiles contains so many variables that it's tough to identify reliable patterns on what causes DCS.

DAN did previously gather profiles exported from dive computers to gather data in DCS incidents. That project ended several years ago.

A study of decompression sickness using recorded depth-time profiles

The Undersea and Hyperbaric Medical Society (UHMS) is an international non-profit organization serving members from more than 67 countries. The UHMS is the primary source of scientific information for diving and hyperbaric medicine physiology worldwide.

doi.org

 

[tursiops]

Hardly any Americans go to Egypt to dive.

Source for this "fact"?

 

[scubadada]

More directly applicable to this thread, some of us would like to see a registry of liveaboard boat accidents. I am somewhat surprised that this was not constructed independently. I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Mike Walker]

More directly applicable to this thread, some of us would like to see a registry of liveaboard boat accidents. I am somewhat surprised that this was not constructed independently. I'm not holding my breath.

Very much agree. Ideally with as much of the management and ownership structure as can be gathered.

Perhaps it could be shoehorned into some SB threads in a dedicated subsection of A&I to get started at least.

 

[MB NZ]

Why do people go to Egypt? Primarily because it's cheap, relatively close to Europe and the diving can be excellent depending on you precise location. People like cheap even at the risk of their own safety. Visitors will keep returning regardless of safety concerns.