the truth about diving organizations

[drbill]

We could always throw the Grand Daddy (Los Angeles County) into the mix! IT is the best.

The advice re: finding a good instructor is indeed the key. There are good (and bad) instructors in all agencies. Look for a referral (or five) in your area from someone who knows the local instructors.

 

[paolov]

What car goes faster, red one or blue? I have a headache.

blue, it has shorter wavelength , means the car is going at a faster rate when approaching in your direction. but after it passes you it may be red. now i think i'm having a headache

 

[fpsndiver]

blue, it has shorter wavelength , means the car is going at a faster rate wne approaching in your direction. but after it passes you it may be red. now i think i'm having a headache

I think I have a headache from reading that....

I have certifications from several different agencies (which has really complicated matters for me to get my trimix cert). The whole thing is really a money making mess right now that could use some international standardization. What about IANTD or PSA or others? Same as above....depends on the instructors. You can have an instructor from any agency (PADI, NAUI, IANTD, whatever) and they could be the biggest googan in the water. References are golden! How many divers have they certified at basic level, advanced level, rescue, and divemaster? How many divers have they declined to certify? Ask for names and phone numbers for some of those divers. Ask around to other divers where you live.....who would they go to? Who do they trust? Then it doesn't matter what agency, call it the North American Compressed Gas Underwater Breathing Association (NACGUBA), who cares? If the instructor is a good diver (has good skills both in the water and in the classroom)with good references and a wealth of wisdom sign up for their class! What I think is the valid question here is this: Which organization which certifies divers is not internationally recognized as a sanctioning body? If I got a card from NACGUBA (which doesn't really exist), and I go diving in Europe somewhere, will that resort accept my certification agency? Then you can say well PADI, NAUI, IANTD, SSI, TDI, PSA, YMCA, and most others probably are recognized. PADI and NAUI being the most recognized right now, however, times are a changin! Instructors and students are tired of paying another dollar in!

 

[Heffey]

We could always throw the Grand Daddy (Los Angeles County) into the mix! IT is the best.

The advice re: finding a good instructor is indeed the key. There are good (and bad) instructors in all agencies. Look for a referral (or five) in your area from someone who knows the local instructors.

Hey drbill,
You may be right. I have heard good things about Los Angeles County certifications.

I get so tired of the old “It’s the instructor that counts” thing (which by the way is true) that I wanted to see what would happen if someone actually picked a side.

I have to say that so far I am very disappointed. :drejnd:

Jeffrey

 

[D_B]

N ot
A nother
U nderwater
I diot

There , that aught to do it :11:

J/K ... Sorry , just couldn't help myself

DB

 

[Tom Winters]

I could have hung my shingle with almost any certifying agency. If I had been on the West Coast, I went with NAUI. I like the idea that the instructors own it and it's not part of a profit-making corporation. Over a period of years though on Oahu, they lost affiliation with every shop they were represented at, even with the presence of a Branch Manager there. They've been a lot beter at supporting shops, and they're even trying to get on the tech bandwagon. well, they're kinda trying.
If I had been on the West Coast, I would have been LA County-certified as well.

 

[Vtdiver2]

Hey drbill,
You may be right. I have heard good things about Los Angeles County certifications.

I get so tired of the old “It’s the instructor that counts” thing (which by the way is true) that I wanted to see what would happen if someone actually picked a side.

I have to say that so far I am very disappointed. :drejnd:

Jeffrey

If you've been reading the topics and threads over the past weeks/months/years....you'll see that what you are looking for has been discussed. You might look for a thread called "What's the one thing you would change..." which was tossed about a few weeks ago.
Although I am PADI certified ( my instructor and LDS are top notch) and I'm starting my DM cert, I am very critical of PADI, and have posted as such on many threads. The bottom line is we answered your question as you posed it....IT IS the instructors that count, not the agency.
Chris

 

[crlavoie]

I see this question a lot and always reminds me of what a weird concept it is that we as group, require "certification". I've been certified since 97 and to this day the whole idea still eludes me.

In addition to diving, I also do a lot of rock climbing and general mountaineering. Arguably, the binary nature of these sports makes them many times more dangerous than what the "average" OW diver is exposed to (if you have not experienced climbing... just take my word for it). The learning curve is extremely steep and the systems and concepts can be ridiculously complex. However, we as climbers have no governing body that says whether I can or can't go climb that 1000' face or if I have the right to buy the equipment to do it. It's simply a personal choice of whether one wants to accept the inherent risk in exchange for the perceived rewards. Granted there are access and land use issues but certainly nobody telling me what I can and can't do based on what THEY think my experience and skills are.

So what? Well, you might have guessed that I think the "certification" concept is utter garbage, a scam, complete BS and you'd be right. More so, I think it creates a false sense of confidence and puts (new) divers in dangerous situations. As a culture (and this is purely my opinion) I think we like things in neat little packages that stake out our boundaries for us. Look around you. It's everywhere.

I don't know for sure that any of this contributes to accidents and injuries. As they say, $hit happens (to anybody). I guess I just have a problem with the whole system... Or maybe my problem is that there IS a system.

 

[bradshsi]

Well, you might have guessed that I think the "certification" concept is utter garbage, a scam, complete BS and you'd be right. More so, I think it creates a false sense of confidence and puts (new) divers in dangerous situations. As a culture (and this is purely my opinion) I think we like things in neat little packages that stake out our boundaries for us. Look around you. It's everywhere.

I disagree on this point. I don't see the certification organizations setting a tone of overconfidence in their OW courses. If anything the reverse is true and they (in my opinion) emphasize caution, safety and diving within your limits almost ad nauseam.

Having a standardized level of training yields benefits that outweigh the drawbacks. I'm sure (for example) the public would feel somewhat unhappy if there was no certification process for airplane pilots.

Imagine jumping untrained into your new Cessna 182 and ramping the throttle to full. Who cares about takeoff clearance, flight plans, weather or weight distribution. After all if anything goes wrong you can only bounce so much. Or perhaps a convenient suburb will break your fall...

The analogy holds good for scuba. In my opinion the agencies do a reasonable job of saving us from ourselves (and more importantly from hurting others). One could criticize the quality of the instructors or the course content but this does not detract from the general benefit of setting minimum training levels.

 

[serambin]

If you've been reading the topics and threads over the past weeks/months/years....you'll see that what you are looking for has been discussed. You might look for a thread called "What's the one thing you would change..." which was tossed about a few weeks ago.
Although I am PADI certified ( my instructor and LDS are top notch) and I'm starting my DM cert, I am very critical of PADI, and have posted as such on many threads. The bottom line is we answered your question as you posed it....IT IS the instructors that count, not the agency.
Chris

Isn't that an indictment of the (all) agencies? Should the agencies be responsible for assuring the quality of the instructors and the classes they teach?

I've certified with three agencies over the years, most recently with PADI (had a great instructor) but the truth is that the quality of a class also depends on the seriousness of the students involved and to a lesser degree, the environment in which the class is held. I can't imagine getting very serious on a resort vacation rush certification.

Stan