Scuba Sciences Regulator Repair Problem

[GreenDiverDown]

Try to find a shop that will sell you regulator parts.

Actually, Darin has a shop that will probably GIVE him parts. Darin... come in sometime when Dan and I are around and we'll hook you up. Bring some regs!

 

[Dive-aholic]

May be a good argument to service our own regs? After all this, gotta admit, the idea sounds pretty good. I work with my hands and with small part all day long. Maybe I can get in on a repair/tech class somewhere....

Darin

You're a DM. Go to DEMA this year and sit in on some of the work shops to get the basics. And get this book.

 

[Rainer]

This thread is getting out of control. Some of you have given constructive criticism and others are unfair and unjust.

Those of you who are questioning our Service Technician's experience level should know he has been trained by just about every scuba manuf out there and even teaches the Scubapro and Zeagle repair classes to Manuf reps and other Service Techs from around the country. He is one of the most experienced (well over 25 years), if not the most experienced in the Phoenix area.

The reason we are not offering a refund is because the service was completed according to Manuf specs, parts were replaced, tested by the customer under air pressure before he left, and everything was working perfectly when it left our facility. There are so many things that could have happened to this regulator after it left: transporting in cars, tossed around in luggage, jostled on boats, misuse, etc. It would be hard to say what happened to this regulator, yet so many of you are quick to blame us. Many of you stated that our offer to the customer was reasonable.

We are not acting anonomously, everything is in plain view. It's easy to make negative comments when you not talking in person and hiding behind a username.

It seems very strange to me that there is not one person in the city of Phoenix that has anything bad to say about any other scuba store in town. When I'm working at Scuba Sciences I have a lot of customers who bring us equipment to service and take our scuba courses when they are not happy with other stores. In fact we had a customer who joined us for our trip to Bonaire last year, had her equipment serviced at another LDS (Their Tech was not certified to work on her Zeagle Products) and the BC auto inflated her to the surface so quickly that they took her to the hospital for observation. So I know issues happen elsewhere.

I hope to see more constructive conversations on SB, and less bashing. After all, this is supposed to be the forum to share experiences, gain knowledge and learn from each other, not turn conversations into a bashing session.

Wow, you guys aren't too bright. Do right by your customer and offer him a refund if that's what he wants. You can be sure that if I'm in AZ, I'll be avoiding your shop. I'm sure many others feel the same way due to this post. Might want to stop the bleeding now. Or let it continue. Good luck with that...

 

[steeleflyn]

Can someone tell me where I can purchase some hiking boots?

 

[Scuba Sciences]

I've had issues with other shops. The difference is I went into the shop, told them the problem, and they put the reg right on the bench and corrected the problem. No questions asked. No finger pointing. No nothing but good customer service. It's already been said, but I'll say it again. The issue is not what happened. The issue is how it has been handled.

Dive-aholic,

That's just it! You went back to the store, told them problem and gave them an opportunity to fix it. Scuba Sciences was never given that opportunity. We did offer to look at his regulator from the get go when we were notified by email in early January, close to a month before anything was posted on SB. In fact, we have offered this to him several times, by email, a couple of letters and SB.

from Shark.byte.usa

it's probably a fair bit of both. I know SS has caught alot of flack in the 2 threads in the last few months, but if you step back from all the collateral issues that have come up, gripes and digs and examine the OPs at the heart of both threads are customer service issues that could have been handled privately and quickly and weren't. Had they been handled effectively when the customers first contacted the shop, long before their SB posts, we would have never heard about these issues, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Garrett,

I can't believe that you think we did not try to handle this privately and quickly. Our offer to completely re-overhaul Mr. Just's regulator was offered the same day he sent the email to me. Not only did we offer to overhaul the regulator, but we also offered to let him use the pool to have a test dive, PLUS after reading some of the posts from SB members, we also offered him to take an Equipment Specialty Course and have his regulator serviced this October, 2007 when it's due again for FREE! How is this not trying to please Mr. Just? It seems to me that many of the Arizona SB members don't want to see the truth that we made every attempt to correct this situation with the customer quickly and privately.

The end result is negative publicity against my company that is not warranted, and I have spent a lot of time responding to SB, to no avail.

I think it is very interesting that both OPs (of these two threads you are talking about) posted negative comments on SB before they spoke to us (either on phone or in person) and allowed us to resolve the situation.

Hey Steeleflyn!!

Have you tried Costco or Cabelas? Good luck!

I've had enough fun for one night, I'm going to bed...:nighty:

 

[Brandon]

I don't sky dive, but if I did, I think I'd be packing my own chute.

A quick aside:

Most skydivers pack their main canopy, but not their reserve. Reserve has to be packed by an FAA certified rigger and if I remember right, has to be repacked every two years. If you rent gear, the chute typically comes packed, but many will pull it out and redo it.

When I did AFF, we were packing our own chutes under an instructor's supervision after the 6th jump.

Little different than scuba, eh?

I miss those skydiving liability waivers - about 6 places to initial that say something to the effect of "I understand there's a pretty good chance that I could die and I won't blame it on anyone except my stupid self for jumping out of an airplane in the first place" They hammer this into your head pretty good.

And on topic: This is turning into a real cluster for Scuba Sciences. Like so many scandals, the situation could have been vastly improved by:

1. Accepting responsibility for any potential mistake made by the service tech.
2. Making it right with the customer.
3. Putting policies in place to make sure that a similar mistake doesn't happen again.
4. Issuing a statement to all customers stating what was alleged to have happened, and what you are doing to ensure that it doesn't happen in the future.

Course - that's a customer service oriented response. We don't see a lot of that in dive shops.

-Brandon.

 

[undefined]

SS -

This entire thread has been a lesson in business management and the cause of the decline in LDS over the years.

1. The phrase "Throwing good money after bad" applies to this situation. You can offer the world, but when the customer has no faith in your service no amount of future service will sway that decision.

2. I can only assume that either your attorney or a stubborn owner/manager decided to stick to your guns on not giving this man a refund for regulator service. If it was your attorney, keep in mind they go to law school, not necessarily business school. If it was your business manager/owner.... well....

3. Your employees have posted on this thread numerous times defending your service tech. Implying that your service tech can do no wrong is a waste of time. Just because he has >20 years of experience does not mean he is impervious to error. Do doctors stop paying malpractice insurance after their twenty year anniversary of practicing medicine?

4. Had you admitted to no wrong doing and given the pittance of a service fee back in refund this would have gone away quickly. Now you are offering more and more to make it go away, but the OP isn't interested. See #1

5. A catastrophic failure of a device immediately after servicing will result in negative publicity. Your last post states "The end result is negative publicity against my company that is not warranted" - what, in your opinion, would warrant negative publicity? Would the OP have had to die to warrant it?

6. You should be grateful that the OP contacted you directly at all. Many people would have contact you through their attorney. The fact that the OP contacted you indicated that he was not interested in pursuing legal action but felt wronged and wished for you to make it right. You obviously could not come to terms, as the past 185 pages have shown quite clearly.

7. This thread has almost 6000 views so far. How many SB members will hit on this thread when they search for Scuba Sciences while trying to find a dive shop in Arizona? How many will read >150 posts... and as of yet find no resolution. I am not in AZ, but I can't imagine that the average diver out there who isn't already a loyal customer will be going to your shop after reading this.

8. If you go to the doc to have a routine procedure done and they screw it up, will a discount or free checkup make you want to go back? What if they didn't screw it up, but the procedure had natural complications - are you a doctor, and would you know the difference? If the OP knew enough about his own gear to maintain it, he wouldn't have paid you anything to do so in the first place.

9. Will the same person that the OP feels made a mistake on his regulator be teaching the free class you offered? That properly isn't instilling a lot of faith.

10. I've tried being an optomist each time I refresh this thread, but all I see is a shop that is standing by the "We did and can do no wrong. The customer is responsible for everything" attitude. Shops like this are closing down around the country and the world. If I were in AZ I'd be saving up for a regulator and programming ScubaToys and Divers Supply's phone number into speed dial right about now.

I, too, have had enough for the night. Maybe tomorrow calmer heads will prevail.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Dive-aholic,

That's just it! You went back to the store, told them problem and gave them an opportunity to fix it. Scuba Sciences was never given that opportunity. We did offer to look at his regulator from the get go when we were notified by email in early January, close to a month before anything was posted on SB. In fact, we have offered this to him several times, by email, a couple of letters and SB.

Tina, you're still missing the point. The point is the attitude displayed on this thread and the other one.

Reread your posts, but try to look at it from the perspective of a customer or potential customer. Put yourself in the customer's position. How would you feel if you felt you received less than expected service from a store you purchase something from and you received a response like that? If you do this, do it with an activity that is not scuba related to help yourself be more objective about it.

 

[redacted]

I can't believe that you think we did not try to handle this privately and quickly. Our offer to completely re-overhaul Mr. Just's regulator was offered the same day he sent the email to me. Not only did we offer to overhaul the regulator, but we also offered to let him use the pool to have a test dive, PLUS after reading some of the posts from SB members, we also offered him to take an Equipment Specialty Course and have his regulator serviced this October, 2007 when it's due again for FREE! How is this not trying to please Mr. Just? It seems to me that many of the Arizona SB members don't want to see the truth that we made every attempt to correct this situation with the customer quickly and privately.

The end result is negative publicity against my company that is not warranted, and I have spent a lot of time responding to SB, to no avail.

I think it is very interesting that both OPs (of these two threads you are talking about) posted negative comments on SB before they spoke to us (either on phone or in person) and allowed us to resolve the situation.

I'm not saying that your offer is not reasonable. From a value standpoint, the offer of making sure the reg is OK now (no damage by SW incursion or other problems), the equipment specialist course, and the free service next year is a generous offer. EXCEPT, it is quite clear that the OP has understandably lost confidence in your shop and simply wants jis money back for the faulty service and to move on. It is clear that he is not trying to extract any more "value" from you than he feels he is due. It seems to me that his losses are pretty much established but yours may still be growing unnecessarily.

You say this is twice now where customers opted to go to SB rather than work things out directly with your shop. Perhaps you should review what folks are saying on this thread and think about why the OPs would have done that. What do you think will happen when another customer who finds this thread has a problem? It's pretty clear to me that customer satisfaction takes a back seat to shop satisfaction. Why else would you not settle this and put it behind you?

 

[Rick Murchison]

This is my final attempt to make the safety point.
Whenever I have a problem with dive equipment service, my principle desire when I talk to the shop isn't about "customer service" or "compensation" - it is about any safety implications in the event.
In this event, the safety implication is that a regulator can get into a user's hands with a second stage that isn't properly torqued.
There is either (1) a deviation from established protocols, or (2) a deficiency in established protocols.
If (1), then a change in QA to eliminate future deviations is required.
If (2), then a change in the protocol is required.
Either way, action is required.
So far, I see nothing being done to prevent another occurance.
Doesn't mean the shop hasn't taken action... but if it has, it hasn't shared it here.
Rick