Jacket BCs versus BP, etc. Help me decide! Thanks.

[divad]

I like the integrated weight system instead of a weight belt. QUOTE]



I like the SS BP integrated weight system instead of a weight belt.

 

[Hatul]

I can't tell you what would be best for you but I can tell you what the vast majority of divers use in tropical conditions and that is by far either a jacket style BC or a back inflate BC. I was certified in 1991 I think it was and have logged over 500 tropical type dives and I can count on one hand how many times I've seen a BP/Wing worn by someone on the boats I've been on or while shore diving numerous times in Bonaire.

You'll find that there seems to be a lot of people on SB pushing the BP/Wing system but in real life when you visit the tropics you'll actually see very few. Or at least that's been my experience.

I agree. Not that that's a good argument for or against, but you will stand out with a back plate.

Adam

 

[TSandM]

Rob, I said nothing about buoyancy. I think a good diver should be able to maintain buoyancy control in any kind of BC, and no matter how it fits.

Why I posted was that someone had, once again, raised the issue that you can't float comfortably on the surface in a backplate. You can. I don't know that I'd want to spend hours on the surface in ANY BC, but I have no doubt at all that I could do it comfortably in any of mine.

Backplates aren't a magic solution to good diving. In cold water, they have major advantages, in terms of reducing total ballast carried, and making a horizontal position in the water easier. In warm water, their major advantage is the stability of the tank, and the minimalist harness which leaves the front of your body free.

We really aren't on different sides of the fence here.

 

[rongoodman]

One of the advantages of BP/Wing is the stainless steel plate which allows 6 lbs or so off your weight belt.

However for tropical diving the SS plate is arguably not appropriate, so you lose one of the main advantages of the BP. You'd be using an aluminum plate or plastic plate and the only advantage is the stiffness of the plate, which also carries disadvantage when you're out of water.

I don't understand why you would say that. Tropical diving involves salt water and usually AL80s, so the SS plate makes more sense to me there than the lighter ones. I don't see any particular problem with the BP out of the water either, even in a T-shirt.

 

[Bronson]

All good input. Thanks. I dive in tropical waters and own one jacket (T-one) and 2 Backinflat BCDs anbd 2 BP/w's For my personal diving is use a OMS BP/w with the Sport wing. With the aluminum bp it is as light as any jacket bcd.

 

[Sas]

Another buddy asked me the other night if I was going to become one of these BP/W proclaimers on SB and I said "Nah, there's enough of those on there already."
Oops!!

Bus-TED

To me it's down to experience levels. I know a lot of new divers find the "blimp and basket" configuration easier to handle and I guess since we hear that a lot it's worth mentioning.

On the other hand, and with all due respect, I personally believe that choosing a BP/W because one can't get their buoyancy control sorted with a jacket is a case of throwing gear at a skills problem.

Lynne and I have had this discussion before and she'll probably say what she did the last time i mentioned that, which is "whatever works works".

That's a valid point, but what I don't like about these discussions is that people who can't get their jackets under control are usually the ones saying jackets are no good.

In all cases, however, what we're really seeing is the expression of an issue with buoyancy control that goes beyond gear. Tellingly, highly experienced divers with excellent control over their buoyancy hardly ever show up on these threads saying jackets don't work.

So yeah. BP/wings work... but so do jackets and with all things equal, the better ones buoyancy control is, the less the differences matter.

I believe you are confusing buoyancy with trim. I think for a lot of people it is easier to trim out in a BP/W. Every person I've seen swap to one has had improved trim (including burna, not that it was bad in the first place, but definitely a difference when he swapped) but that's just my experience.

Also BP/W still offers benefits to a warm water diver, mainly the stability of the tank as well as it is cheaper than most BCs and more modular.

 

[hg frogman]

Just to clarify. I should have been more specific from the start.

IMO there are many crap jacket-style BCDs or back-inflate BCDs : too much padding, too many gimmicks, too bulky in and out of the water, too heavy, and too expensive.

Hence I can understand why many divers (including me) prefer the inherent simplicity of a BP/W.

When I talk about jacket-style BCD for traveling, I refer specifically to those jacket (not back-inflate) BCDs, usually entry-level and intended for rental and clubs, that are very simple, quite strong, light, and cheap. They usually don't have integrated weights. For example Scubapro T-One or T-Sport (my personnal favorites), Aqualung Wave or Mares Rover. More pricey but still with the same philosophy you have the Scubapro Classic Sport, an excellent BCD.

For traveling, IF YOU DON'T NEED MUCH LEAD, ie not more than, say, 8 to 10 pounds (so that depends upon your physionomy, your suit, your tank, your skills, etc.) then these simple jacket-style BCDs are a good and cheap alternative to BP/Ws and shouldn't be underrated. The OP has to know that he has some choice and that the BP/W is not the only way to go for his specific demand (travel, warm waters).

And these simple jacket BCDs weigh the half of my SS BP+Wing. Weight is not always a concern (it depends where you travel) but it can be. I know there are lighter BP than SS, but with these lighter plates much of the arguing about better weight distribution becomes pointless.

And finally, getting rid of all the excess weights should be the Holy Grail of any diver, and that's often the real problem underneath those BCD vs BP/W issues.

 

[Madacub]

Ibussell, it's probably best to try a BP/W (and maybe different other BCDs) for yourself first. Or are you determined to buy something/anything right away? You could also research the threads on this board - some of them are more comprehensive and helpful than this one has been so far. (The topic is well worn, that's for sure) Just from my personal experience, I tried it at about 80 dives and bought one as soon as I could. Also note that lot of people have a SS backplate for home use and an aluminum or other lightweight option for travel. For myself, (tropical diving only) if the operation has aluminum tanks, I use my SS and if they have steel tanks, I use my aluminum backplate. That's the way my weighting works out, you may be different, so if you can, try things out before you decide. Final point, for what it's worth: more and more recreational divers are using the BP/W set up.

 

[lbussell]

Wow! A lot of good information! Even though I've only dived about 20 times I feel very comfortable and relaxed in the water, and my buoyancy control is good. The simplicity of the back plate systems appeal to me. So do the prices! I'm glad that I've still got 3 weeks until Cozumel to get my gear. Thanks for all of the advice. If you guys think of anything else I appreciate it!

 

[Hatul]

I don't understand why you would say that. Tropical diving involves salt water and usually AL80s, so the SS plate makes more sense to me there than the lighter ones. I don't see any particular problem with the BP out of the water either, even in a T-shirt.

Look, it's not an accident that when you travel to the tropics you don't see a lot of back plates. Even with the Al80 you don't need a lot of lead, so there's not a lot of point in shifting weight to the back. You also run the risk of having little ditchable weight. Which is why I said arguably because there are those that dive with no ditchable weight, which I disagree with.

Out of the water I'd rather have a soft BC to a hard plate. Carrying a large plate of metal is not exactly the most ergonomic. I've had the plate interfere with tank holders on boats, it's awkward in lockers, and in spite of what some will tell you it is more awkward to pack.

Adam