Aluminum 80 Cost - Is this reasonable?

[captndale]

$ 120 + tax At Deep blue AL80 set to go
Shop around!

$120 for an aluminum 80 is just about their cost to bring it into their shop. If they have similar markups on the rest of their equipment you can expect them to close soon. That way maybe you can get some real deals at the bankruptcy sale. :05:

Few LDS's make any money on selling aluminum tanks because they have a history of being heavily discounted. $200 is actually a reasonable retail price. Because other shops are willing to sell them at no markup, however, that shop will probably not sell many. Maybe that is their intention.

 

[PhilEllis]

Thought this might be of interest to some of you.

Here in the eastern part of the US, almost all luxfer cylinders are purchased from Peter Skop Industries. If your dealer orders the typical 10 to 20 cylinders at a time, these are his real costs.

The wholesale 1-24 quantity price for luxfer aluminum 80 cylinders is $104 plus approximately $11 each for shipping. This yields a final price of $115 per cylinder. On an order of 20 cylinders, your dealer would have approximately $2300 invested in the product. If he sold them over a period of two months for $140 each, he would make a profit of $500 on the investment of $2300, or a profit margin of about 20%. Air isn't any where near free. (all you need to do is maintain a PROFESSIONAL, RETAIL air compressor for about a year and you will see) If he gives you any air fills at purchase time, that simply adds to his cost for those cylinders (or subtracts the air cost from the $500 profit). Clearly, when your dealer sells a scuba cylinder, that transaction is a lost leader. There is no other way to look at it.

Now, if you dealer is able to move LARGE volumes of cylinders, say ordering in quantities of 100 per order and moving around 500 cylinders per year (only 10 or 20 dealers in the country are capable of this), they can be purchased for as low as $90, possibly with free freight (but not always). To move this number of cylinders (regardless of how big your dealer is), they would have to be sold at internet prices (around $120), and it still works out to a very low profit margin and return on investment.

The bottom line, regardless of your local stores business model, or regardless of the cheaper priced internet store business model, CYLINDER SALES ARE A LOST LEADER!

Don't beat your local guy up too much on cylinder price. The business economics vary GREATLY with geography. Maybe he is only doing what he has to do at his volume level. Anyway, just my input. Thanks.

Phil Ellis
Dive Sports Online
www.divesports.com
(800) 601-DIVE

 

[mtsidford]

A good scuba tank will last for a very long time. I imagine you typically rent tanks from a LDS. Most LDS rent aluminum tanks. Have you ever rented or borrowed a steel tank? Steel tanks have better bouyancy characteristics. They also can pack more air into a smaller package, meaning you are more compact, hence better drag ratio under water, and it's lighter to carry to the dive. Personally I would try a steel tank prior to purchasing an aluminum. The added air in a smaller package and less weight needed on the weightbelt outweigh a few extra $ in the long run. Sid

 

[ghrousseau]

Get a new shop..............that's BS that they charge $7 per fill if you don't buy their tanks. I'm sure they are screwing you on everything else you buy.

 

[SDAnderson]

Luxfer S080 with a Thermo DIN/K valve: ~$150 - 165, including sales tax.
Air fills: ~$5 - 7
Nitrox fills: ~$7 - 10

The standard around here is to give you your new tank full of air and with a new VIP sticker on it. After that first fill, you're usually on your own. Most of the shops around here will want to VIP any tank that has been opened or completely drained for any reason, including shipping.

Do your own math to decide which is the best deal and don't worry so much about what it costs elsewhere. Nothing lies down that path but envy and frustration.

 

[dannobee]

Sports Chalet in CA sells the AL80 Catalinas for $99 when on sale a few times a year and $119 the rest of the time, and air fills are $5. Not bad, if you ask me.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I guess I'll go with the local LDS becuase I will definatly use more than 10 fills. If I don't they'll treat me like crap and give me low fills, anyway.

I hadn't thought about Nitrox but I've looked into it and am taking the class next month. I'm assuming once I go Nitrox I won't want to go back to air, so the year of free air will be useless.

Here's the kicker: My LDS price for 80cf of EAN36 = $20

Just because you go take the nitrox course does not mean you'll dive nitrox exclusively. Do a drift dive where max depth is 15-20 ft and nitrox is a waste of money. save it for those 50-100ft depth dives. I rarely dive trox with students in ow classes. they are usuall;y not deep enough or down long enough to make it worth it. Plus are these new tanks going to be nitrox clean and will you be using nitrox compatible air until you do dive nitrox. Als is he going to put nitrox stickers on them from the get go or are you going to have to pay extra in a month for stickers and a o2 cleaning. Better check before you give up the cash. My pst steel 80's were 200 and were set up for nitrox from the beginning. My lds stickered them and did the vis and gave free initial fills of ean32 I've had them for a year and since they were marked nitrox from the beginning the annual vis includes new nitrox stickers. All in all it still sounds like a rip for 200 bucks for an al80. Just on principal I'd drive the extra few minutes.

 

[staticcornflake]

These tanks are Catalina's with genesis valves, which I have heard should be cheaper than luxfers. I'll probably just order from Scubatoys for about $10-$15 shipping. I'm hoping that even if I do that my LDS will ignore the $7 fill price when I am filling daily for DM. (at least I hope they will). I need to get my reg serviced too, so I bet they'll screw me on that too, becuase I bought from Leisure Pro. (worth it).

I'll also look into steel, but right now it's lloking like I can get 2 AL80's for the price one steel 110.

Maybe I'll buy one of those hand operated compressor pumps:10:

 

[JS1scuba]

These tanks are Catalina's with genesis valves, which I have heard should be cheaper than luxfers. I'll probably just order from Scubatoys for about $10-$15 shipping. I'm hoping that even if I do that my LDS will ignore the $7 fill price when I am filling daily for DM. (at least I hope they will). I need to get my reg serviced too, so I bet they'll screw me on that too, becuase I bought from Leisure Pro. (worth it).

I'll also look into steel, but right now it's lloking like I can get 2 AL80's for the price one steel 110.

Maybe I'll buy one of those hand operated compressor pumps:10:

I've followed this thread a bit and have some comments you may not like. I read a few posts back that you plan to work with this dive center to earn your divemaster rating. As a Dive Master this is the first step in being a professional in the industry. As such you may either want to find a dive center you would like to work with on a long term basis or change your attitude about working with them. To think that a Dive Master candidate belives his sponsoring center will "screw him" on regulator service and will not support the center with appropriate purchases of needed equipment makes me feel that should you achieve Dive Master status you may not fully grasp how influential a DM is on new divers. DM's should happily support the dive center they work with. If you are not in a postion to do this with them from the outset you may want to seek another center to earn your DM rating with.

A poor attitude on the part of the DM is very damaging to new divers and to dive center customers as well.

You need to find a happier place to do your training and purchases with.

Regards,

 

[Wayward Son]

He makes a good point. If you're going to DM at this shop, you have the total relationship to consider.