Why No HOG Reg Reviews in Recreational Dive Magazines?

[chrpai]

You obviously know not what you speak of stating that there is a skill set gap in the reviewer.

Obviously. <sarcasm/> I do know that if you switch out a piece of gear and try it once or twice that muscle memory is not going to be the same.

PS- I don't worship divers of any level. You can be offended for your friend but I stand by my comments.

 

[Slamfire]

4) For the doubles, he puts a Hog on his primary post and then complains about the location of the high pressure port. Typically the primary is on the right and you don't need an SPG on that side anyways. Lots of people dive Hog doubles and don't have problems doing valve drills [-]so I suspect a skill problem not an equipment problem[/-].

Chrapi,

You obviously know not what you speak of stating that there is a skill set gap in the reviewer...
I know you love your Hogs - that's fine, but questioning skills of someone that far exceeds your capabilities only degrades your input.

I was about to reply saying that I had not seen any skill gap comment, but I went back to re-read the post looking for it. When I originally read Duane's review my impression was that he was commenting about a slightly more uncomfortable or less familiar. At no point did I interpret that to be a disabling feature that would totally prevent you from doing the drill. I never had a doubt that the reviewer was able to competently perform the drill. What I did think was that his complaint was just a matter of putting in some more practice time with that specific reg in order to completely overcome his "difficulities". In that sense, yes, it could be categorized as a skill problem (with all due respect and in no way trying to detract from Duane's accomplishments).

In any case, his complaint seems so slight that I took it almost as a non-issue. I have grabbed my Mk10s countless times on my way over to the hand wheel. I've learned to recognized the different touch, shape and texture and just quickly move farther back to the hand wheel. If anything, the longish Mk10 serves as a landmark to help locate the handwheel. I see no problem like Duane does. You just get used to it, recognize it and dont spend any time trying to turn a reg like a handwheel.

All in all it's not a "bad" review but I can't agree with the conclusion.

I would tend to agree with chrpai here. I did find Duane's review helpful. I liked that he pulled no punches, because it seems to signal this is NOT a commercially motivated review from a magazine. But, I think his complaint's were about minutiae that could either be easily be overcome with just a few hours or, it's just a matter of personal taste for things that are not super relevant one way or another.

 

[chrpai]

IIn that sense, yes, it could be categorized as a skill problem (with all due respect and in no way trying to detract from Duane's accomplishments).

I would tend to agree with chrpai here. I did find Duane's review helpful. I liked that he pulled no punches, because it seems to signal this is NOT a commercially motivated review from a magazine. But, I think his complaint's were about minutiae that could either be easily be overcome with just a few hours or, it's just a matter of personal taste for things that are not super relevant one way or another.

Exactly. I didn't mean to imply he had skills problems in general. If you get really used to something and replace it with something else you have to build your skills back up. A while back my wife got cancer and I retired from diving. I even gave all my gear away. When I started diving again I heard about this new kid on the block called Hog and I went looking for reviews to see if it was worth my attention. Duane's is one of the reviews that I read and I appreciated all of his comments. At the end of the day, I weighed the minutiae, judged the conclusion and went with Hog. I'm glad I did.

PS- There's the concept of argument of authority and it's really week. Saying Duane is a better diver then me therefore his opinion is correct and is no more valid then the crap LDSs pawn off on new divers every day with the help of these so called "reviews" found in the magazines.

---------- Post added March 31st, 2013 at 06:58 PM ----------

Couldn't the lack of advertisement be part of the business model I hear so many talking about on Scubaboard?

That and the lack of traveling sales reps.

 

[ams511]

I worked in the publication industry for many years. In general, magazine reviews are neither honest nor unbiased. The magazine's profits largely come from advertising not subscription sales, so they are not going to upset an advertiser with a poor review. Use magazine ads as starting points and then move on and look at individual opinions from divers.

Duane's review is just his opinion. I would not place any more weight on his opinion than I would on any other experienced diver's opinion. His is just one point of view. There are many reviews on SB and other BBSs.

 

[drbill]

I stopped subscriptions to all dive magazines (except DAN's Alert Diver) years ago. I don't pay for advertisements. If I want reviews of gear, I look here and elsewhere on the Internet.

The only HOG gear I Have is one of their 32# wings. I love it. If their regs are like the wing, I'll definitey consider them when the last of my Mk10/G250s bites the dust in another 10-20 years

 

[ScubaSteve]

I love how quickly a HOG thread turns into a pissing match . It seems to have fallen into ranks with Split fins, Air2, Spare Air etc.. You cannot say you like OR dislike it without getting pounced on.

Besides, you guys all actually know that HOG is the best regulator EVER in the whole history of regulators. This is a fact because you have now read it on the internet. I like HOG (dive'em myself) and I believe that every review carries with it some bias.....and yes Duane's is no different.

I do believe the "Why" of the OP has been sufficiently covered in the above posts.

 

[ontdiver]

"I do believe the "Why" of the OP has been sufficiently covered in the above posts"

It has, thanks very much.

 

[chrpai]

Couldn't the lack of advertisement be part of the business model I hear so many talking about on Scubaboard?

I'd suspect there is another difference in the business model also:

ScubaPro / Aqualung - Get a new diver and quickly sell them $3000 worth of gear in 1-2 years. The diver typically then retires from the sport a couple years later (or sooner).

Hog - Get an active / advanced / tech diver and establish a long term relationship. Overtime sell them multiple regulators, wings, backplates and so on... eventually more then $3000 worth.

 

[Seefourdc]

I'll see your Duane article and one up you this thread wherein Joel Silverstein gives Hog his approval as well as banking his life on it: HOG Regs?.

I think if one of the pioneers of wreck diving banks his life on the regs they must get the job done not to mention his students lives. He is/was one of the earliest Andrea Doria divers as well as the USS Monitor and the U-869.

The only thing Duane didn't actually like about the regulators is that they weren't what he was used to. Of course he's not going to immediately be comfortable with anything different... to even call that an actual criticism is silly. Ask anyone who performs at a high level of anything to change to a new product and they will always hate it for whatever their period of adjustment is. A highly practiced person's equipment is like an extension of him or herself. I know this will come off as offensive but it ought to be said. For people to say that he honestly reviewed them without actually giving it a period of adjustment and really putting the regs to the test is kind of shameful. Again, apologies. I don't actually think that's what Duane was saying either... I really took it more as he didn't want to put in any more effort because it was uncomfortable for him; however, anti-hog people seem to try to twist his article into meaning more than it appears to mean. I think if you smashed all of his apeks equipment and he actually had to fork over more money for a whole new rig he'd probably have to take a long, hard look at whether it would be worth it for a similar performing, but slightly foreign to him product.

Just my thoughts FWIW.

 

[eelnoraa]

4) For the doubles, he puts a Hog on his primary post and then complains about the location of the high pressure port. Typically the primary is on the right and you don't need an SPG on that side anyways. Lots of people dive Hog doubles and don't have problems doing valve drills .....

I can comment on this a bit more clear. I believe what Duane means is NOT the high pressure port of the HOG first stage. Rather, it is the high pressure end (with red environmental seal end) sticks out more than Scubapro Mk25 or most balance piston first stage when mounted horizontally with the 5th port facing inside of the double setup. Mk25 when mounting that say it is almost flat with nothing blocking the valve. With HOG, the 1st stage stick out a little. In valve drill, one can potentially grab the first stage instead of the valve wheel. Nothing major, just a little inconvienice if you are not used to it. It is my personal experience compared to Mk25 as well. I don't think this is unique to HOG tho, same thing should apply to DST and Hollis DC1 type of first stage.