Virginian diver dead at 190 feet - Roaring River State Park, Missouri

[Whitrzac]

What I read said that it was reported that "too-rich diluent" was SUSPECTED. I didn't see anything that said it had been verified.

If that has been reported as a fact, rather than a suspicion, can you please post a source? An actual link would be great.

Taken right from the reporter with the team

Tragedy at Roaring River State Park - Cassville Democrat

KISS Rebreathers divers gathered at Roaring River Spring Friday morning for what was meant to be a day of preparation for the team’s planned second record-breaking dive into Roaring River Cave on Saturday. Instead, the day turned tragic when, shortly after submerging, 27-year-old Eric Hahn, of...

www.cassville-democrat.com

 

[formernuke]

So still preliminary but very likely the case. This begs the question on how/why was the diligent to rich.

 

[stuartv]

Taken right from Mike, the team leader, Eric's dive partner, and the manufacturer of the rebreather he was using...

Tragedy at Roaring River State Park - Cassville Democrat

KISS Rebreathers divers gathered at Roaring River Spring Friday morning for what was meant to be a day of preparation for the team’s planned second record-breaking dive into Roaring River Cave on Saturday. Instead, the day turned tragic when, shortly after submerging, 27-year-old Eric Hahn, of...

www.cassville-democrat.com

A "preliminary" conclusion, and from the Highway Patrol.

I think I will believe that when they report what the actual mix was in his cylinder.

Meantime, I will not be saying/repeating/promulgating any "facts" about what happened.

 

[Brad_Horn]

What was the documented and published OSHA compliant 'standard' KISS Rebreathers were using on this scientific diving to mark and differentiate their cylinders for depth? Anyone got a link to it?

Based on this imagery In depth at 472 feet the only identifiable element appears to be white, silver or yellow cylinders? But if so, which were which, and what gas mix?

 

[Brad_Horn]

Connecting my DIL to the Air tank was a major oversight from my part, and as I mentioned in the video it won't happen again, not just because the Sidewinder was modified so -like my Spirit- it can be connected on either side if needed, but also because this incident taught me a valuable lesson.

How was the KISS Sidewinder modified so this couldn't happen again?

 

[Brad_Horn]

My Trimix was 16/40. My necklace regulator was connected to my Trimix, I mentioned in the video that had I bailed out I would've been fine because I would've bailed out to trimix. At max depth my Trimix PO2 would've been 1.1.

What gas was your BOV connected to?

 

[Manatee Diver]

What was the documented and published OSHA compliant 'standard' KISS Rebreathers were using on this scientific diving to mark and differentiate their cylinders for depth? Anyone got a link to it?

OSHA doesn't apply to scientific diving. It is specifically granted an exemption as long as they follow AAUS guidelines and apply for it.

But even AAUS standards only apply if you are directly working with an institution. Like I don't believe WKPP or KUR follow AAUS standards They have their own SOP that they follow. And since it isn't a job, OSHA doesn't apply either.

 

[Bierstadt]

I am going to have to vent here a little bit. I have been following the RR project off and on, and I was shocked and saddened to hear that Eric passed away. We lost a diver in Lake Erie this summer and that was horrendous as well, plus I doubt we will ever learn exactly what went wrong technically so it's never quite mentally settled. I have been generally impressed with how the RR team has handled the situation, and I was surprised and pleased to check in tonight and see Gus had posted. And I was equally appalled to see how a couple people in this thread have written like judgmental d**ks. Good freakin gosh, am I glad I never shared one of my incidents here if this is the response. I am disappointed in SB right now. Kudos to the people who spoke up and toned it down.

If anyone is offended, please PM me. I don't want to sidetrack this discussion now that it looks like it is getting back on track, and I am certain Gus has better things to do than come back here and apologize for not being a perfect diver.

 

[Brad_Horn]

OSHA doesn't apply to scientific diving. It is specifically granted an exemption as long as they follow AAUS guidelines and apply for it.

But even AAUS standards only apply if you are directly working with an institution. Like I don't believe WKPP or KUR follow AAUS standards They have their own SOP that they follow. And since it isn't a job, OSHA doesn't apply either.

Thanks for that. But I note it differs from the AAUS interpretation of how OSHA applies to scientific diving irrelevant of the umbrella that the scientific diving is being conducted under....
Following AAUS standards doesn't seem mandatory, it just appears to be one accepted way for Cave CCR scientific diving of meeting the OSHA exemptions.... One would presume based on the below that WKPP and KUR if "scientific diving" as per the permits for this events dive meet the below in their own way.

Diving Standards

aaus.org

"In 1982, OSHA exempted scientific diving from commercial diving regulations
(29CFR1910, Subpart T) under certain conditions that are outlined below. The final guidelines
for the exemption became effective in 1985 (Federal Register, Vol. 50, No.6, p.1046). AAUS is
recognized by OSHA as the scientific diving standard setting organization.
Scientific Diving Definition
Scientific diving is defined (29CFR1910.402) as:
“Diving performed solely as a necessary part of a scientific, research, or educational activity by
employees whose sole purpose for diving is to perform scientific research tasks. Scientific diving
does not include performing any tasks usually associated with commercial diving such as:
Placing or removing heavy objects underwater; inspection of pipelines and similar objects;
construction; demolition; cutting or welding; or the use of explosives.”
Scientific Diving Exemption
The two elements that a diving program must contain as defined by OSHA in 29 CFR 1910
Subpart T 1910.401(a)(2)(iv) are:
a) Diving safety manual which includes at a minimum: Procedures covering all diving
operations specific to the program; procedures for emergency care, including
recompression and evacuation; and criteria for diver training and certification.
b) Diving control (safety) board, with the majority of its members being active divers,
which must at a minimum have the authority to: Approve and monitor diving projects;
review and revise the diving safety manual; assure compliance with the manual; certify
the depths to which a diver has been trained; take disciplinary action for unsafe practices;
and, assure adherence to the buddy system (a diver is accompanied by and is in continuous contact with another diver in the water) for SCUBA diving.

OSHA has granted an exemption for scientific diving from commercial diving regulations under
the following guidelines (Appendix B to 29 CFR 1910 Subpart T):
• The Diving Control Board consists of a majority of active scientific divers and has
autonomous and absolute authority over the scientific diving program’s operation.
• The purpose of the project using scientific diving is the advancement of science; therefore,
information and data resulting from the project are non-proprietary.
• The tasks of a scientific diver are those of an observer and data gatherer. Construction and
trouble-shooting tasks traditionally associated with commercial diving are not included
within scientific diving.
• Scientific divers, based on the nature of their activities, must use scientific expertise in
studying the underwater environment and therefore, are scientists or scientists-in-training."

 

[tursiops]

Thanks for that. But I note it differs from the AAUS interpretation of how OSHA applies to scientific diving irrelevant of the umbrella that the scientific diving is being conducted under....
Following AAUS standards doesn't seem mandatory, it just appears to be one accepted way for Cave CCR scientific diving of meeting the OSHA exemptions.... One would presume based on the below that WKPP and KUR if "scientific diving" as per the permits for this events dive meet the below in their own way.

Diving Standards

aaus.org

"In 1982, OSHA exempted scientific diving from commercial diving regulations
(29CFR1910, Subpart T) under certain conditions that are outlined below. The final guidelines
for the exemption became effective in 1985 (Federal Register, Vol. 50, No.6, p.1046). AAUS is
recognized by OSHA as the scientific diving standard setting organization.
Scientific Diving Definition
Scientific diving is defined (29CFR1910.402) as:
“Diving performed solely as a necessary part of a scientific, research, or educational activity by
employees whose sole purpose for diving is to perform scientific research tasks. Scientific diving
does not include performing any tasks usually associated with commercial diving such as:
Placing or removing heavy objects underwater; inspection of pipelines and similar objects;
construction; demolition; cutting or welding; or the use of explosives.”
Scientific Diving Exemption
The two elements that a diving program must contain as defined by OSHA in 29 CFR 1910
Subpart T 1910.401(a)(2)(iv) are:
a) Diving safety manual which includes at a minimum: Procedures covering all diving
operations specific to the program; procedures for emergency care, including
recompression and evacuation; and criteria for diver training and certification.
b) Diving control (safety) board, with the majority of its members being active divers,
which must at a minimum have the authority to: Approve and monitor diving projects;
review and revise the diving safety manual; assure compliance with the manual; certify
the depths to which a diver has been trained; take disciplinary action for unsafe practices;
and, assure adherence to the buddy system (a diver is accompanied by and is in continuous contact with another diver in the water) for SCUBA diving.

OSHA has granted an exemption for scientific diving from commercial diving regulations under
the following guidelines (Appendix B to 29 CFR 1910 Subpart T):
• The Diving Control Board consists of a majority of active scientific divers and has
autonomous and absolute authority over the scientific diving program’s operation.
• The purpose of the project using scientific diving is the advancement of science; therefore,
information and data resulting from the project are non-proprietary.
• The tasks of a scientific diver are those of an observer and data gatherer. Construction and
trouble-shooting tasks traditionally associated with commercial diving are not included
within scientific diving.
• Scientific divers, based on the nature of their activities, must use scientific expertise in
studying the underwater environment and therefore, are scientists or scientists-in-training."

What is the point you are trying to make?