SBP Superflow hoses vs other’s?

[halocline]

Interesting. So there is no risk of leaking or hose coming off when underwater if hose is not tightened to the specified torque?

There is no specified torque for the connection between the hose and the 2nd stage, the SP splined tool is not a torque wrench, it's just basically a fancy open end wrench that fits the SP hose fitting. You couldn't use a regular torque wrench if you wanted to on that fitting, although there are adapters called 'crowsfeet' that attach to torque wrenches for use on regular nuts. The seal at both ends of the hose is made by o-rings and is not affected by how tight the fitting is.

But addressing your question about hoses coming free unintentionally, I personally tighten mine slightly more than hand tight for that specific reason. The fitting on the 1st stage end of the hose is more likely to loosen unintentionally, and I have seen that happen, just enough to cause the o-ring to extrude out and cause a bad leak. On the 2nd stage end, the fitting has an o-ring that is more deeply buried (less likely to extrude) and there is a swivel that allows the 2nd stage to rotate, so movement of the stage does not twist the hose. I don't know if that's clear.

If you have not yet started your technical dive training, you might want to talk with your instructor before making any big regulator purchases. I mention this because you're asking some pretty basic questions (that's good!) and you might benefit from an instructor's guidance. All the regulators you are talking about on this thread are excellent, there's no problem there, but you are talking about a fair amount of money.

 

[Pearlman]

If you have not yet started your technical dive training, you might want to talk with your instructor before making any big regulator purchases. I mention this because you're asking some pretty basic questions (that's good!) and you might benefit from an instructor's guidance. All the regulators you are talking about on this thread are excellent, there's no problem there, but you are talking about a fair amount of money.

Hey,
Yeah, I hope I am not taxing people needlessly, having to explain basics. The truth is I’ve been “landlocked” geographically for decades due to the priority of earning one’s living with little opportunity for eyeballing (no dive shops around my geo to work or simply hang around and learn in) and observing hands-on skills in this field or learning by doing except when I am actually on vacation (forget being an unpaid apprentice even for the passion of it). So I’m just trying to build a mental model using the opportunity for Q&A posts on this forum. And so this being my first reg and costly purchase I’m just conversing online to find gotchas and learn in the process. For example as a result of this thread, I learned “not to twist the insides of the 2nd stage” (in simplistic terms) and upset the carefully tuned mechanism while screwing or unscrewing hoses by using two wrenches - one to hold steady the 2nd stage… that by itself is a an invaluable learning lesson that would never have triggered in my brain (despite having seen some videos and reading material on mechanics and construction of regulators) - not without the extensive time taken by sincere and patient responders to my posts on this forum and various other threads I’ve been littering my comments on. I’ve possibly been saved from costly mistakes…

But on the whole I think I’ve got the key stuff pinned down mentally so as not to damage my expensive new purchases by mishandling out of ignorance, thanks to this specific thread. And I think this thread can now quieten down, having satisfied my basic queries. You see - For the last 10 years I counted the cost of flight tickets to indulge in this hobby and opted to rent gear at the dive shop rather than buy my own out of a mindless penny-pinching attitude (even when I could still have afforded it in reality. And where every flight ticket equalled the cost of a budget 1+2 stage reg at minimum), but now I counted the money saved in lockdown having not taken dive vacations for a few years until last Nov., so it hit me that I always had the budget but never considered it. Not to worry on that front - This has always been a hobby mostly for those with surplus income TBH. Besides I started realising after my recent dive vacation that I am bored with all the rec diving I've been doing and need to upskill and upgrade myself. Hence this latest shopping adventure with expensive gear on my list.

Yeah ideally I should talk to a potential instructor to get these answers but I am yet to decide on one, and all said I don’t think I am on the wrong track but with reasonable confidence that my purchases will help me do both backmount and sidemount courses (of course additional customization and purchases required).

FWIW I come from a pre-google and pre-YouTube era where I naturally learnt to mentally visualise whatever I read on complex subjects, and with fortunately a rare (for my country) access to well stocked libraries most of my growing years. Hence this exercise of engaging people to elicit answers that I capitalize on to improve my confidence in handing things.

It’s a challenge in a geography that lacks a water sports culture and the only reason I am in this hobby is that I was a schoolboy cadet who grew up in a naval base with a crewcut in my teen years and got some exposure to water sports and training including sailing and rowing (besides basic seamanship skills and military/rifle drills and parades), and not just because I saw stuff on TV.

But a big Thanks to Everyone who responded on this thread. I’ll continue posting on the other threads once the gear I want is in my hands.

PS: Also Thanks to the Whisky I’m drinking till 5am today - for the rather elaborate closing address… Cheers

 

[Angelo Farina]

The advantage of the Superflow hose is that it does not occlude even if twisted sharply or knotted.
However, I never heard of a normal hose getting occluded in these ways.
The other good thing of SP hoses is the finned nut at the second stage connection. The finned nut is designed for being torqued by hand. No tool is required.
Tech divers usually hand-torque this hose connection, so in some situations you can swap the second stages of two independent regs. I use SP hoses and I always hand-torque them.
However a special tool is on sale: this is useful when the finned nut was over-torqued, and you are not able to unscrew it by hand.
I do not own it: in case of need, a normal plier, used with some care, does the same job.
Long Scubapro superflow hoses are available, but perhaps not so long as you like. They are usually yellow, as the long hose is employed on the reg which is planned to be donated.
I have three of them, approximatrly 120cm long. Plenty enough for my use case. I bought them on Ebay for just a few bucks more than unbranded hoses.

 

[rhwestfall]

The finned nut is designed for being torqued

I'd like to dee the documentation of that.... I don't know the truth, and many urban legends exist for various things, but the increase of surface area for better heat transfer (cold water diving) is what I have heard (undocumented, and maybe hearsay...)

 

[Angelo Farina]

I'd like to dee the documentation of that.... I don't know the truth, and many urban legends exist for various things, but the increase of surface area for better heat transfer (cold water diving) is what I have heard (undocumented, and maybe hearsay...)

I think that better heat transfer is the reason for the finned nut on the reg, not for the nut on the hose.
I was hand tightening the hose even before than finned nuts were invented, but unscrewing by hand an hex nut in cold water can be really difficult.
So I greatly appreciated the finned nuts, they made hand tightening and unscrewing much easier!

 

[Alaskan Scuba Dude]

So then I need not buy the Scubapro proprietary tool for >100$ just to reconfigure my hoses (backmount/sidemount/singles). Just use a padded wrench and spanner to undo the factory tightened original hoses and rely on finger-tightened connections….

I saw a regulator that was only finger tight blow off the hose. It was a real eye-opening experience. I think our instructor did it on purpose.

 

[halocline]

I think that better heat transfer is the reason for the finned nut on the reg, not for the nut on the hose.
I was hand tightening the hose even before than finned nuts were invented, but unscrewing by hand an hex nut in cold water can be really difficult.
So I greatly appreciated the finned nuts, they made hand tightening and unscrewing much easier!

Are you talking about the splined nuts that fit the SP splined wrench? Or are you talking about some other nut with 'fins' like a wing nut, designed to be loosened and tightened by hand? I've never seen anything like that on a scubapro (or any other) regulator hose.

If you're talking about the common splined nut on the SP hoses and some of the 2nd stages, then I disagree that it has anything to do with hand tightening or heat transfer. It's just another example (there are many) of SP using a proprietary fitting that requires their own tool. The fact that SP makes and sells a specific wrench for those nuts means that they clearly do not intend for them to be hand tightened.

 

[rhwestfall]

They still dramatically increase surface area, thus heat transfer. They are a heatsink.....

 

[BoundForElsewhere]

They definitely transfer money well. Cash-sink.

 

[Angelo Farina]

Are you talking about the splined nuts that fit the SP splined wrench? Or are you talking about some other nut with 'fins' like a wing nut, designed to be loosened and tightened by hand? I've never seen anything like that on a scubapro (or any other) regulator hose.

If you're talking about the common splined nut on the SP hoses and some of the 2nd stages, then I disagree that it has anything to do with hand tightening or heat transfer. It's just another example (there are many) of SP using a proprietary fitting that requires their own tool. The fact that SP makes and sells a specific wrench for those nuts means that they clearly do not intend for them to be hand tightened.

The wrench is a tool for loosening the finned nut. Not for tightening. The wrench cannot be used with a torque meter, hence it is not designed for tightening.
Any mechanical engineer's handbook contain a phrase saying something as "splined nuts are designed for hand tightening".
Any engineer, as me, seeing for the first time the SP splined nut thinks immediately that it is for hand tightening...
As this is what is written in his manual!
Regarding heat exchange: some finned nuts are effectively designed for improving heat exchange. But this is typjcally done for air cooling. The air-to-metal heat exchange coefficient, in natural convection, is very low, typically just 5-10 W/(m2s).
In water, instead, the natural convection heat transfer coefficient is much larger: 2000÷5000 W/(m2s). Hence a finned nut gives no practical benefit to heat transfer, underwater.