OOA Buddy starts to drag you up by your octo - What would you do?

[Thalassamania]

Thalassamania is right....in water recompression because of an accelerated ascent and missed safety stop is probably not the best idea. Actually, in-water recompression is rarely a good idea unless you are far far away from a chamber and have an FFM mask on board.

Especialy when you consider that everything over 30FSW/MIN is thought of as "accelerated" these days.

 

[ReefHound]

Are you really suggesting that every diver in that situation would be safe to go back down to finish up a safety stop?

Since the words I've used already to explain that each diver must make their own decision whether or not the risk of drowning out weighs the risk of a DCS hit when considering in water deco / safety stops after an emergency ascent, please give me the words that will help you understand this. It would make things a lot easier.

~ Jason

Of course not, I was responding to the part that the decision was already made for us.

 

[darkpup]

In this case that happens to be correct, sorry if that hurts your feelings, that was not my intent, this is a two plus two equals four question, not a matter of opinion.

Feelings hurt? Yeah, right. Good luck with that.

I just started out trying to clarify some confusion.

What confusion? I wrote the comment "deco / safety stop" to cover all bases when describing recreational decompression methods, and you jumped off the deep end bringing up required deco obligations from tech dives. I for one believe that all dives are deco dives, and that the idea of adding a 3 to 5 minute safety stop (on a recreational dive that doesn't require one) is done to reduce the risks of DCS (i.e. a deco stop).

Like I said before, you call it what you want, but don't accuse me of being confused when it was you that took my words out of context.

~ Jason

 

[darkpup]

If the risk of DCS is low, no point in performing an omitted "safety stop". If the risk is high, the danger of performing the stop is significant, and unless this is the ONLY option (diving hundreds of miles from the nearest chamber) it's probably not a good answer.

I wouldn't get back in the water, myself.

I'm still not sure how this is contrary to what I said. If you read back through my statements, I believe I said that every diver has to asses the risks associated with an in-water safety stop after a fast ascent vs. the risk of a DCS hit.

At no time did I say this is what I would do, nor that I recommend doing it. I stated that it's an option you should consider based on training, experience, frame of mind, and the conditions / environment.

Also, from your previous post (i.e. the full face mask or a support team comment), when did I ever say going down solo is an option?

~ Jason

 

[all4scuba05]

In my uneducated opinion, the act of going back down to safety stop depth would probably do more harm than good, as you would be recompressing whatever bubbles are in your blood and allowing them to pass back through your heart.

Dude, a chamber ride does the same thing...that's what you want to see happen. Bubbles get compressed. They flow through the heart and then through the pulmonery arteries to the lung where they get expelled.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Taking statements out of context is precisely what you did by giving your lecture on how mental preparation without in water training is ineffective since I never suggested that it was.

I know ... and responding to my earlier comments with ...

So I guess we can just eliminate the classroom sessions from the Rescue course?

... was precisely the same tactic, since I never suggested any such thing.

You DO know that I am an instructor, and that I teach these classes. So why would you imply that I think they should be eliminated?

If you don't like strawmen, don't create one. If you do, then don't complain when someone tosses it back in your face.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[darkpup]

Of course not, I was responding to the part that the decision was already made for us.

Wow!!!! Talk about taking my comments out of context.

ICE9 mentions his OW instructor stated that you should never go back down after you reach the surface (or something close to that). I then comment that the decision was made for him by his instructor, and I agree with his OW instructor because OW students do not have the training or experience to safely determine when it is and is not ok to go back down for the omitted deco / safety stop.

I'm not sure what I expected. I don't really expect everyone to read what I type, let alone understand what I'm trying to convey.

~ Jason

 

[Soggy]

Dude, a chamber ride does the same thing...that's what you want to see happen. Bubbles get compressed. They flow through the heart and then through the pulmonery arteries to the lung where they get expelled.

Ugh...please don't give me decompression theory lessons. I am not going to even attempt to explain the difference to you.

 

[darkpup]

Dude, a chamber ride does the same thing...that's what you want to see happen. Bubbles get compressed. They flow through the heart and then through the pulmonery arteries to the lung where they get expelled.

Yes, but the chance of drowning due to a complication that arises in the chamber is non-existent. Drowning is a risk associated with going back down to take care of an omitted deco / safety stop, and it's not one you should take lightly.

~ Jason

 

[Thalassamania]

What confusion? I wrote the comment "deco / safety stop" to cover all bases when describing recreational decompression methods, and you jumped off the deep end bringing up required deco obligations from tech dives. I for one believe that all dives are deco dives, and that the idea of adding a 3 to 5 minute safety stop (on a recreational dive that doesn't require one) is done to reduce the risks of DCS (i.e. a deco stop).

Like I said before, you call it what you want, but don't accuse me of being confused when it was you that took my words out of context.

~ Jason

The confusion is evident in your choice of terminology. When you try and cover "all the bases" you wind up covering none of the bases because your lack of clarity makes you appear confused. A Deco stop and a Safety stop are not the same thing, many of us made literally millions of dives without ever making a single safety stop and we are no worse the wear for it. The entire concept of a safety stop came about (and I can say that with some authority in as much as I was one the folks in the room having the conversation) as a result of concern over the rapid ascent rates that were being observed in recreational divers. Have you ever thought why three minutes? Simple, a 130 foot dive should have an ascent time of two minutes and change, data at the time was suggesting that a slower rate from 30 to the surface was in order, so add another minute. That’s where it all came from, that’s what it was (and is) about, nothing more than a way to stretch out the ascent. Now, serendipitously, it had some other advantages and was the first step toward deep stops and riding the bubble.

Now contrast that with a scheduled staged decompression stop, which is required because a diver took up sufficient nitrogen during a dive that M₀would not permit an ascent to the surface without significant offgassing first.

And yes, all dives are deco dives, but then so is a ride in an elevator. It’s a matter of degree. But blowing by a “safety stop” is not the same thing as blowing by a “deco stop” to confuse the terminology is to give more importance than it deserves to one and less than it requires to the other.