Not Feeling Well? New Hand signal.

[EFX]

In my OW class I was taught the thumbs up signal meant going to a shallower depth. This signal could be followed by the number of feet or meters for the new depth. I have since adopted the NACD (National Association of Cave Divers) one-handed signals. In an overhead environment the thumbs up means to exit to open water immediately. This signal must not be overruled and needs to be returned by the buddy. In open water the thumbs up means let's go to the surface now bypassing any deco or safety stops. It also cannot be overruled and must be returned by the buddy. In both cases the buddy pair stays together throughout the dive.

For those of you who are wondering how to signal going to a shallower depth since the thumbs up signal in OW means going to the surface immediately, the NACD recommends raising an open palm toward the surface followed by the numerical signal for the new depth. The open palm signal without a new depth simply means go a little shallower or get off the bottom.

There are a couple of advantages to using one-handed signals. For night diving you can shine a light on the hand used for signaling or, while one hand holds an object (ex. camera, knife, slate, light, etc.) the other free hand can signal without having to clip things off to have both hands free.

 

[Umpman]

Sorry not to sound rude but I'm really confused what is your point? You completely disagree with me showing you documentation that OW divers are required to know the "end a dive" hand signal and are required to learn the "end a dive" hand signal and are required to demonstrate the "end a dive" and signal. And just so we are all clear the "end a dive" hand signal is pointing your thumb in the upward direction AKA thumb a dive.

I was not disagreeing with you, I was disagreeing with @ChrisDee. They responded to my post by saying “There is NO student training on signalling to their instructor they are in trouble. This isn't in any training manual, isn't taught, and is an issue that all respondants can not document whatsoever. Students are NOT taught how to signal if they need help, nor is this part of any training syllubus”. I was pointing out that you just documented that signals are taught and demonstrated on the first dive.

You are I are on the same page

 

[GF99/99]

I was not disagreeing with you, I was disagreeing with @ChrisDee. They responded to my post by saying “There is NO student training on signalling to their instructor they are in trouble. This isn't in any training manual, isn't taught, and is an issue that all respondants can not document whatsoever. Students are NOT taught how to signal if they need help, nor is this part of any training syllubus”. I was pointing out that you just documented that signals are taught and demonstrated on the first dive.

You are I are on the same page

Sorry my mistake . Yes agree were both on the same page.

 

[Umpman]

Thumb. No need to say why. It is a command signal.

Yes. When I was certified 30 years ago, and when I went through it again last year as my wife was getting certified, I was taught, if someone THUMBS the dive, the buddy responds with a thumb up followed by an OK. There is no question asked. Go up and discuss on the surface. I had a situation where I thumbed the dive because I was experiencing suit squeeze. Should I really have tried to explain under water that my chest is tight and I’m struggling breathing. We go up and then when I’m safe we discuss it.

Recently I thumbed a dive with an Instabuddy because when I go down to the bottom, the instabuddy was acting wreckless. First they tried to descend with out using the line (in a very strong current). Then when we got to the bottom, the person kept swimming off by themselves and then tried to enter a wreck that I was not comfortable going into based on conditions. Now that person may not have liked that I thumbed the dive, but IMO, he was being unsafe and I didn’t trust him with my life and considering this was only the 7th Dive for the diver, I didn’t want to have to rescue him.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

ANY of the multiple issues will suffice. No need to detail the entire litany underwater, is there?

I don’t know, I give up on this thread I’m getting a headache, and I need to load my truck for tomorrow’s job, so I have to go.
Who cares?

 

[Robert H. Diver]

So, other than OW buddie diving, we are in complete agreement. There is NO student training on signalling to their instructor they are in trouble. This isn't in any training manual, isn't taught, and is an issue that all respondants can not document whatsoever. Students are NOT taught how to signal if they need help, nor is this part of any training syllubus. And no one here can find any documentation otherwise.

(This is NOT the same as ending a dive, for any reason.)
(And reffering to nebulus hand signals that could be subject to wide interpertation, dosen't cut it either.)

What “trouble” are you running into??? There’s signals for something wrong, low air, out of air, cramp, cold, stuck, entangled in line, danger, broken. I mean what more do you want? Wave your hand or light, get their attention and communicate your problem….

 

[GF99/99]

I think the real question that we all should be asking is…

How much does it cost to use this new hand signal? Or is there a specialty course you must buy the e-learning for be for you can use it? And even better do you get a certification card once you complete the im feeling ill hand signal specially course?

 

[DreadnoughtNH]

I think the real question that we all should be asking is…

How much does it cost to use this new hand signal? Or is there a specialty course you must buy the e-learning for be for you can use it? And even better do you get a certification card once you complete the im feeling ill hand signal specially course?

That's PADI for you! Put Another Dollar In.

 

[boulderjohn]

I thought about this thread while drifting off to sleep last night, and I realized I may have been missing a point about it, even though I referenced it somewhat in my first post. In that post, I said that it was important to indicate that you might be having a medical problem on ascent so that a buddy will be sure to ascend with you to be able to provide help along the way. I was talking about normal diving. Last night I realized there is a related point that applies specifically to OW instruction.

If this is what Chris Dee was trying to communicate, I apologize for not understanding him.

Let's say you are on an OW dive and realize you are having a medical problem and want to ascend. You signal the intent to ascend, and you may even give an emphatic thumbs up indicating your growing sense of panic. But you do not indicate you are having a medical problem. I said it was important to give such a sign so someone will ascend with you at all times, but there is an additional problem on an instructional dive.

In an instructional dive, the instructor will likely never have seen a diver want to ascend for a medical reason, but he or she will have seen students suddenly panic and want to go to the surface for no good reason. In that case, the instructor will likely try to prevent that ascent and even force a safety stop when it is imperative for medical reasons that the student reach the surface as soon as possible. I believe something like that happened a year or two ago, and we had a thread about it.

It is possible the new sign is an attempt to solve the problem of someone arresting a necessary ascent. If that is so, then that needs to be made clear. Students should be told about the need to signal that they are having a medical problem if they thumb a dive.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Let's say you are on an OW dive and realize you are having a medical problem and want to ascend. You signal the intent to ascend, and you may even give an emphatic thumbs up indicating your growing sense of panic.
But you do not indicate you are having a medical problem. I said it was important to give such a sign so someone will ascend with you at all times, but there is an additional problem on an instructional dive.

Why don't you just signal problem and point to your body? This new signal doesn't indicate medical problem. Could be don't feel well.

In an instructional dive, the instructor will likely never have seen a diver want to ascend for a medical reason, but he or she will have seen students suddenly panic and want to go to the surface for no good reason. In that case, the instructor will likely try to prevent that ascent and even force a safety stop when it is imperative for medical reasons that the student reach the surface as soon as possible. I believe something like that happened a year or two ago, and we had a thread about it.

Yeah, I don't think so. If I have a student that does not want to be underwater, we are all going up and sorting it out. I'm not asking for trouble. There was an issue with Scott Cassell's girlfriend taking an open water course from an SSI shop in Monterey.

It is possible the new sign is an attempt to solve the problem of someone arresting a necessary ascent. If that is so, then that needs to be made clear. Students should be told about the need to signal that they are having a medical problem if they thumb a dive.

Nope. Not needed. "Problem." "Point to body", "thumbs up." Done.