Future of OC trimix

[wetb4igetinthewater]

These studies are speaking about adult Americans, you are speaking about divers. Two different groups.

Agreed, while I am a diver, early 50s living in the United States, I am anything but an adult!

 

[crofrog]

These studies are speaking about adult Americans, you are speaking about divers. Two different groups.

If you don't provide a proof that divers (not only American divers!), on average, have the same culture, physical issues, and bias of adult Americans, you just can't use those articles.

"Cardiac-related medical problems are a leading cause of death in divers and risk factors for an acute coronary event are well documented even in dive professionals, including smoking, overweight/obesity, and high blood pressure"

So where they unaware of their cardiac issues prior to death, or were they diving in-spite of their knowledge of the risks.


Shreeves K, Buzzacott P, Hornsby A, Caney M. Violations of safe diving practices among 122 diver fatalities. Int Marit Health. 2018;69(2):94-98. doi: 10.5603/IMH.2018.0014. PMID: 29939385.

 

[boulderjohn]

I am a data guy and I know you like facts too do you know if there is any research that try to understand how much spread this syndrome is? And, even more interesting, if there's a trend in time?

Nope. That's why I ended my post with "I have no idea."

 

[boulderjohn]

So where they unaware of their cardiac issues prior to death, or were they diving in-spite of their knowledge of the risks.

I have no doubt some dive in spite of risks. Here is a truly frightening story.

I have in the past written stories of cave diving incidents for NSS. One story was never published because of complications that should be obvious. Two divers were heading to the water at the cave at Peacock Springs, and they saw two divers in the water who had evidently just finished a cave dive. One of them was fiddling with his gear, and his buddy was behind him, floating face down. The two arriving divers rushed into the water, pulled him out, and worked on reviving him while paramedics were called. Eventually the guy was fully conscious and alert. He told the EMTs that he knew why he had passed out, it had happened before, and it would happen again. He refused any further medical care and left. When I interviewed them, the divers who performed the rescue said it was their understanding that he was an instructor.

So there's an extreme case. How many are like that? As I said before, I have no idea.

 

[ginti]

"Cardiac-related medical problems are a leading cause of death in divers and risk factors for an acute coronary event are well documented even in dive professionals, including smoking, overweight/obesity, and high blood pressure"

So where they unaware of their cardiac issues prior to death, or were they diving in-spite of their knowledge of the risks.


Shreeves K, Buzzacott P, Hornsby A, Caney M. Violations of safe diving practices among 122 diver fatalities. Int Marit Health. 2018;69(2):94-98. doi: 10.5603/IMH.2018.0014. PMID: 29939385.

You are speaking of the divers who died. But there are all the others.

To be clear, I am not saying you are wrong in your conclusions. I see different findings, but you might be right, and I might be wrong (or vice versa). Who knows, with the little data we have?

What I am saying is that you are using and interpreting data improperly. The data you are citing says nothing about the issue we are discussing.

 

[crofrog]

You are speaking of the divers who died. But there are all the others.

To be clear, I am not saying you are wrong in your conclusions. I see different findings, but you might be right, and I might be wrong (or vice versa). Who knows, with the little data we have?

What I am saying is that you are using and interpreting data improperly. The data you are citing says nothing about the issue we are discussing.

The following is supported by data in the studies I cited. Feel free to post studies of something other than your opinion to refute it. If 40% of people that reflect the general population are unaware of their CVD risk factors, and the leading cause of death in divers is cardiac events, then the question that needs to be answered is:

So were they unaware of their cardiac issues prior to death, or were they diving in spite of their knowledge of the risks?

 

[rx7diver]

The following is supported by data in the studies I cited. Feel free to post studies of something other than your opinion to refute it. If 40% of people ...

@crofrog,

Percentages can be tricky. At the very least I would like to know the numerator and denominator. And how the sampling was done. Divers are such a small fraction of the general population. So, unless the random (?) sample was very large (or, maybe, stratified), it is unlikely that many (if any) divers were captured by the sample--which is important if divers are unlike others, in general (which is probably true, I think).

My apologies if you already know this. Your profile contains very little about you.

rx7diver

 

[Wibble]

There's often this tendency in life to hear distant hooves and think Zebras.

We've all got to go sometime and it's always better to go doing the things you love. Just because someone has a medical issue doesn't mean to say they'll keel over at the first opportunity. Many people dive with 'issues', it's up to them to do their own risk assessment.

 

[ginti]

The following is supported by data in the studies I cited. Feel free to post studies of something other than your opinion to refute it. If 40% of people that reflect the general population are unaware of their CVD risk factors, and the leading cause of death in divers is cardiac events, then the question that needs to be answered is:

So were they unaware of their cardiac issues prior to death, or were they diving in spite of their knowledge of the risks?

Here you are speaking about divers who died, not divers in general. They are two different groups.

Anyway, my point is really another one: where have you read that scuba divers reflect general population? And how do they reflect it?

 

[crofrog]

@crofrog,

Percentages can be tricky. At the very least I would like to know the numerator and denominator. And how the sampling was done. Divers are such a small fraction of the general population. So, unless the random (?) sample was very large (or, maybe, stratified), it is unlikely that many (if any) divers were captured by the sample--which is important if divers are unlike others, in general (which is probably true, I think).

My apologies if you already know this. Your profile contains very little about you.

rx7diver

well good news I cited all of the studies. So feel free to dig into them.