Diving with men

[padiscubapro]

divemistress once bubbled...
A new friend, a guy, invited me to dive with him this weekend, but I'm kind of worried since I've never been diving with men buddies.

Some of the posts I've read in this section (by men!) make men divers sound like awful buddies: pushy, aggressive, bossy, air hogs, etc. I swear, they sound like a different species!

Plus I hear men buddies get freaked out by little things -- like if you don't like getting so cold that your vital organs freeze. Or if you take a few minutes to, you know, center yourself before a dive, instead of being the first person off the boat. And if they see a Tampax in your bag -- like the one you forgot to put away when your period ended last week -- they're sure they're shark bait!

So, should I give men divers a chance? Or should I tell this guy I've already got plans -- with the girls?

Thanks!

I've been teaching long enough to see a few "typical" trends..

1) new men divers tend to be more confortable in the water and think they are better than they really are.. many new women divers seem to be unsure of themselves but definately learn the initial skills better than most men because they pay better attention and aren't trying to be competitive.


2) most women will use less gas than a man will with similiar experience levels.. This can't be avoided men have more muscle mas which requires more oxygen, get stuck in a working situation women need much less oxygen.. You can learn to relax during a dive and get gas consumption way down... at depth you don't need as much oxygen as on the surface and with efficient breathing techniques gas consumption can be very low for either a male or female. My gas consumption is typically under .5 cuft / min at the surface.. so I'm usually the one regardless of sex with lots of gas left over after a dive... now I dive an RB so unless another RB diver is around I'm the last one back on the boat..


3) even though women in general have a higher body to fat ratio most women feel the effects of cold before a man even though they are physically probably in better shape with respect to core body temperature.. No diver should hide it if they are cold.. let your buddy know and end the dive.. the increased risk of DCS is not worth it.. If the buddy doesn't like it, dont risk your safety and dont dive with that buddy again.

4) thrill seekers... men in general are more likely to push the limits of their training... Both are equally capable of pulling off complicated dives.. many men try it without the training (and learn on their own through screw-ups and close calls) while most women do it the right way and get training..


I break up husband/wives during training.. I try and keep them as far apart during training as possible.. this way each person becomes self suficient and the husband cant pressure the wife..


I feel equally confortable diving with other men or women, the only extra concern I have is that when I do technical dives I usually treat them (for myself) as solo dives since someone of less stature than myself would probably have difficulty doing a rescue if needed.. this goes for men or women but probably applies to women a bit more...

Don'T ever give into peer pressure to hurry up setting up and getting into the water... I like to be the first one in/last out but I don't ever compromise my predive checks regarless of what a buddy wants to do..

 

[diverbrian]

ppilot once bubbled...


It would be nice if this were true, but it just isn't. I remember once offering my seat on a bus to a (very) pregnant woman. I thought she was going to kill me for insinuating that she might need to sit down. True story. It's not easy to be a man these days.

That is why I don't bother trying to determine which. I treat all women to the gentleman side until they prove that they wish to be treated differently. As Cathie stated, normally that doesn't happen. It does at times, but if she has a problem with it, it is her problem and NOT MINE.

It is normally about respect shown. BTW, the I will offer a guy a seat, etc. if he looks like he has hard day and needs to get off his feet, too. Again, it is a matter of respect and trying to do a good turn for someone. It feels good to help others out in small ways. If someone cares to take it wrong, I will let them do what they want to do.

It's hard to believe that this thread was started essentially as a joke and the orginator admitted it. I give DM credit for starting a thread with staying power.

 

[drbill]

In an era when common courtesy seems to have been lost, you never know what to expect. I try to treat others of either gender the way I'd like to be treated (I remember something about a Golden Rule but we devalued our "currency" a long time ago). I hold doors for the people behind me whether they are male or female, but especially if they are aged.

I also expect courtesy towards me which seems to be sorely lacking in southern California based on what I experience with visitors (and residents) here on Catalina. People will walk right into me if I'm walking on the right hand side of the sidewalk. They may be walking 5-6 abreast and I don't know where they expect me to move. I just say out loud "I'm not stopping." Sometimes they look at me like I'm an idiot. I always look at them knowing they are idiots.

See it in Catalina's Dive Park often as well. Probably more so with snorkelers than other divers, but too many occasions of lack ofg courtesy or awareness with divers too. Last weekend I had a guy dive in from the wrong side of the stairs and almostr hit me as I was swimming to them to exit. He looked at me like I was in his way.

Bring back some of the social mores of the 50's and early 60's. Hell, even the late 60's were pretty good from what little I ccan remember!

Yes, I have become the man I feared.

Dr. Bill

 

[wapyaly]

scuba_jenny once bubbled...


Don't give up hope, there are a few of us left that appreciate the kindness of a gentlemen.

Thanks to my feminist sisters (of which I am NOT a subscriber) I have to tolerate doors slamming in my face, uncomfortable men who don't know what to do about helping a lady out. I am a lady and I like to be treated as one. I work in a completely male oriented department (I am the only female in the whole of the worldwide company, in my role) and I am treated with respect and like a lady (even down to my Snr Manager offering me his arm as we go down stairs) I happen to like men and be treated like a lady and helped out with heavy stuff (coz I am not that strong) I know I will have to rely on my boyfriend when diving due to a back problem and I will be very grateful that I have him with me, Oh yes and to fight of sharks with his big knife too!!

 

[VaScubaGirl]

I feel bad for men these days. They never know when being nice (whether she needs the help or not) is going to result in an irrate and insulted woman! I think the world can do with a lot more niceness from both sides of the gender gap

 

[diverbrian]

As I said, if you show the courtesy in respectful manner, it is up to the person in question to take it or leave it. This isn't MY problem. I will be myself and that is all that I can do. I don't change that for anyone anymore.

 

[cavewoman]

OK first of all i need to say this....

All women appreciate being treated like humans.... not like fragile little delicate pieces of china.

I myself tend to be a little sensitive about chauvanistics. When a man offers to do something for me, I tell him yes if I want him to and no if I don't. Of course the offer is always appreciated. Now, when a man tells me I should dive an al80 while he dives a steel e-series.... only because its heavier....I get ticked off.

I Know my own limits as does every other woman or man.... If I can handle to do something, I'll do it. In fact, most of the time on my dive trips, I'm the one who carries all the tanks around and cleans off all the equipment because I want to! I love to help people and I feel I can help most men as well as women. WE ARE ALL EQUAL! MEN: Don't be afraid to help if u think its needed. WOMEN: Don't expect everything to be done for you just because of ur gender.

We are NOT in the 50s or 60s so Get with the times.

PS. NEVER TAKE A PREGNANT WOMANS REACTION TO HEART!

ONE WORD: Hormones!

 

[drbill]

Cavewoman wrote: We are NOT in the 50s or 60s so Get with the times.

No, we are not... but there were many things about that era we shouldn't have abandoned. Chauvinism yes. A woman's place is in the home, yes. But not common courtesy (and I'm not speaking strictly of male/female interactions).

Dr. Bill

 

[divermasterB]

I agree Bill.

There is not enough common courtesy. That means both ways.

Men who want to help, and women who don't want to feel like they are being talked down to.

I know I hate it when people, who I know shouldn't be, talk down to me. I can only imagine what it would be like to be a woman and face that from overly macho men on a regular basis. Just understand, not all of us are in it for the ego trip.

 

[divemistress]

what he taught me: every activity is not a test. i do not have to prove myself every minute of every day. and most importantly, there is a great difference between help, which is kindness, and patronization, which is insulting.

scene: i'd pulled my kayak onto shore after spending a lovely morning on the bay. then took a deep breath and prepped myself to carry the beast several hundred yards to my car.

it's 55 lbs and nearly 15 feet long --not overly heavy, but darned awkward. as i started to hoist it, a man approached.

he: "let me help you with that."

me, gritting teeth -- with exertion? or irritation at the anticipated put-down?: "i can handle it myself."

he: "of course you can. but why should you?"

dm

divermasterB once bubbled...
I know I hate it when people, who I know shouldn't be, talk down to me. I can only imagine what it would be like to be a woman and face that from overly macho men on a regular basis. Just understand, not all of us are in it for the ego trip.