DIVING OVER 50 YEARS OLD

[DocVikingo]

If you ask for medical certs for over 50s, then you should ask for everyone diving there.

I don't believe that this is a well-supported opinion.

According to DAN's Annual Diving Report 2012-2015 ( Divers Alert Network ), it received notification of 561 deaths worldwide involving recreational scuba diving during 2010-2013. Only the deaths of 334 US & Canadian recreational divers were actively investigated by DAN. It found that high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease and diabetes, all of which are unequivocally age-related (see below*), were the most common causes of diver deaths in this group. Of the deceased, 78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older. This would suggest that the aging diver is at increased risk of medically-related death from recreational scuba relative to other age groups.

Regards,

DocVikingo

*
Prevalence of coronary heart disease by age and sex
https://www.heart.org/idc/groups/heart-public/@wcm/@sop/@smd/documents/downloadable/ucm_449846.pdf

Prevalence of high blood pressure in adults ≥20 years of age by age and sex
http://www.heart.org/idc/groups/heart-public/@wcm/@sop/@smd/documents/downloadable/ucm_449851.pdf )

CDC - Rate per 100 by Age, Race, and Sex - Diagnosed Diabetes - Data & Trends - Diabetes DDT

 

[dead dog]

I don't believe that this is a well-supported opinion.

According to DAN's Annual Diving Report 2012-2015 ( Divers Alert Network ), it received notification of 561 deaths worldwide involving recreational scuba diving during 2010-2013. Only the deaths of 334 US & Canadian recreational divers were actively investigated by DAN. It found that high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease and diabetes, all of which are unequivocally age-related (see below*), were the most common causes of diver deaths in this group. Of the deceased, 78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older. This certainly would suggest that the aging diver is at increased risk of medically-related death from recreational scuba relative to other age groups.

Regards,

DocVikingo

*
Prevalence of coronary heart disease by age and sex
https://www.heart.org/idc/groups/heart-public/@wcm/@sop/@smd/documents/downloadable/ucm_449846.pdf

Prevalence of high blood pressure in adults ≥20 years of age by age and sex
http://www.heart.org/idc/groups/heart-public/@wcm/@sop/@smd/documents/downloadable/ucm_449851.pdf )

CDC - Rate per 100 by Age, Race, and Sex - Diagnosed Diabetes - Data & Trends - Diabetes DDT

" 78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older "

All this shows is the divers 50 years or older were at less risk then the divers 40 yrs of age or older. So I would guess divers 60 to 70 years old would be at an even less risk.

The point is you don't tell one group that they have to do it and not the other group.

 

[Lorenzoid]

" 78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older "

All this shows is the divers 50 years or older were at less risk then the divers 40 yrs of age or older. So I would guess divers 60 to 70 years old would be at an even less risk.

I think the difficulty interpreting the data lies in not knowing how many divers are in each age group. If there are very few divers over 80 years old, then "of the deceased" there are going to be very few over 80 years old.

The point is you don't tell one group that they have to do it and not the other group.

That sounds like a moral judgment. What kind of discrimination is "okay" and what kind is "not okay" involves making moral and/or legal distinctions.

 

[dead dog]

I make no moral judgment on anyone. I just don't like being told what to do and when to do it by you or DAN or the State or Federal goverment. Just don't trend on me.

 

[DocVikingo]

"78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older " All this shows is the divers 50 years or older were at less risk then the divers 40 yrs of age or older. So I would guess divers 60 to 70 years old would be at an even less risk.

As for your statement that the report finding of "78% of males and 90% of females were 40 yrs of age or older; 58% of males and 59% of females were 50 years or older" only serves to show that divers 50 years or older are at less risk than divers 40 yrs of age or older--well, that "dog" flat out don't hunt.

If you would have taken the time to peruse the DAN Annual Diving Report that I linked for you in my initial post above, you would have seen on page 14 that the percent of fatalities for the age groupings 40-49, 50-59 and 60-69 frankly tower over those for the other age groupings, with the 50-59 age group by far the most elevated of the lot.

With the possible exception of the outlying 70-89 group, if one were inclined to single out an age group from which to obtain medical clearance in order to dive, these findings would appear to form a somewhat defensible basis for setting the threshold at 40 and older.

This is neither an endorsement nor a rebuttal of what "clarkey" is proposing. Rather, it is simply intended to contribute to an informed and reasoned discussion of the topic among those open to making a sincere effort.

Regards,

DocVikingo

 

[JamesBon92007]

The DAN fatality data for 2010-present do indicate a spike in fatalities in the 50-59 age group..

Is that "spike" based upon percentages or is it simply a sum total? If there are more divers now who are over 50 then it might be logical for there to be more fatalities in that age group.

This is a little off-topic but I have read several posters state in various threads that there are fewer fatalities now than there used to be back in the early days of scuba diving. Judging from all of the incidents and deaths reported here on ScubaBoard that's a bit hard to swallow. I can only wonder where some of these "statistics" are coming from. The most usual answer is that nobody really knows how many divers actually dive compared to how many certified divers there are. Obviously there are a lot more divers now, but fewer incidents per X number of divers? Does anyone have any real data?

As others have stated I would feel compelled to find another OP too. My blood pressure is lower than when I was in my 20's, I exercise regularly, dive fairly frequently, eat much healthier than I used to (which wasn't very bad), and engage in activities far more strenuous than most boat dives so if I was going to drop dead suddenly it would most likely happen doing something else besides diving. I try to keep myself in shape specifically for diving and i'm confident that I can (and have on several occasions) assist someone else if needed and swim a mile to shore if the boat sinks (assuming the current isn't too strong ) I suspect I can swim more laps underwater without surfacing that most youngsters but I don't really have any data to base that on. I'm 63.

If someone wants to require me to have DAN or other insurance then I would probably consider that to be a reasonable request, especially considering the description of the location in question. But to not allow me to dive because I'm over 50? That to me is ridiculous Last December off of Cozumel I dove with a lady who is probably about 80. She is one of the best divers I've ever been in the water with. She had perfect neutral buoyancy, unbelievably low air consumption, found tons of interesting stuff, was able to anticipate the sea creatures, and had lots of great stories to tell. If she was to suddenly die while diving with me I would be happy to recover the body knowing that she died doing what she wanted to be doing.

 

[JamesBon92007]

Yes I amended our website a couple of days ago with a 'holding policy' for now. I'm still thinking through the best way to approach this. I've exchanged a number of emails with DAN who have no specific answers. They said that in the absence of proper medical facilities or transport here that they would need to talk someone through procedures over the phone, and then maybe wait until the next day to arrange transport. That's not something that reassures me! Neither ourselves or anyone else around here has an oxygen supply that can last that long. The reality though is that is the facilities don't exist, then not even DAN can use them!
!

You don't have enough oxygen on the island to last one day for one diver? You might want to start taking up a collection. How much money could that possibly take? How many scuba tanks do you have on hand, and how much did they cost?

If you were to present yourself as simply being a place to rent and fill tanks then I might be able to understand the lack of a basic emergency supply.

 

[DocVikingo]

I'm new to the over 50 club so this thread got my attention....
The last time I took a general physical, it only took fifteen minutes and most of the conditions they checked for had no potential for acute impact on diving (blood test for liver function, colorectal thing, etc.). In fact, it was so basic, I probably would have to had been actively dying right there for the exam to find anything out of order.

Don't know when your last general physical was, but as a now reportedly healthy 50 yr old your next exam should, and if capably done will, include measurement of blood glucose levels (and possibly of urine glucose), a routine ECG to (if for no other reason) establish a baseline, and of course assessment of blood pressure. As data suggest that high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease and diabetes, all of which are unequivocally age-related, are the most common medical causes of scuba-related deaths, such an exam should at least provide some degree of comfort even if not conducted by a diving medicine savvy doctor.

Cheers,

DocVikingo

 

[KevinNM]

You don't have enough oxygen on the island to last one day for one diver? You might want to start taking up a collection. How much money could that possibly take? How many scuba tanks do you have on hand, and how much did they cost?

It's actually requires a huge amount of gas. Typical EMS rate is 15l/minute, but those little med tanks are just used to get you to an ambulance with a huge tank, which transports you to a hospital with thousands of gallons of LOX in a tank farm out back.

 

[chillyinCanada]

I'm confused as to how one dies on scuba from diabetes unless you are meaning that diver's heart failure was due to underlying diabetes?