Cave line vs ziptie

[Bismark]

Using two zip ties doesn't factor into the argument either way. You brought up the zip ties used on corrugated hoses. The fact that everyone uses two zip ties at each end isn't an "admission that the former isn't ideal". I agree with your conclusion, just not that particular argument. Sorry if I wasn't clear.



I agree. You went through the process, tried both ways, and saw for yourself the reasons why one approach was better. Isn't this the best way for people to learn things for themselves?

I just get tired of seeing someone asking a simple question in order to learn something, and getting bashed like crazy when they try to figure out more of the reasons behind the answers they get. You've got to stop bashing folks for asking the "Why?"s behind the answers they get.

Tom

PS-Sorry for quoting you Gombessa, my comments are mostly directed elsewhere.

Nothing wrong with asking but when you get an answer you don't like and you turn it in to an argument it just looks silly. Particularly when the person arguing is speaking from a level of experience that is significantly less than those who answered the question to start with. Ask the question, get the answer, ask for clarifications if needed, but if you want to challenge the answer I suggest that the person doing so recognize from whence the answer came. Just my 2cents. Everybody has probably been down the same path.

 

[Meng_Tze]

I am confused now.... so which is better?

 

[b1gcountry]

Really, when was this? Because I can assure you that zipties were out of favor before the term DIR even existed.

The Fundamentals of Better Diving was published in 2000. All the photos in the book have a zip tie attaching the bolt snap to the long hose. Page 79 shows it pretty clearly.

Tom

 

[pengwe]

pg. 80 says clips should be 'wire-tied', but I'm not sure what that means. Maybe those black tie-offs in the pictures are wire?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

The zip ties (2) used to attach power inflators to the corrugated hose and to the wing elbow are not exposed to the twisting motions like SPGs, lightheads and backup lights have. Those zipties are holding a rubber hose onto a rigid plastic pipe. For awhile now Halcyon has experiemented with a bolted plastic band clamp instead, but it really doesn't eliminate the failure point completely (e.g. the hose can rip). The zipties with a peice of inner tube covering the sharpish ends is currently 'state of the art'.

But yes even those zipties can and do sometimes fail and that's why a "balanced rig" is required as well.

This question/comment might be approaching the DIR "limits" but, I am not comfortable with zip ties holding either the corregated hoses of the Bc or regulator mouth pieces. I generally use aircraft safety wire which is twisted to provide a very secure connection. We constantly hear of mouth pieces falling off regs. and I personally know of one incident where the diver inhaled water upon failure and came close to drowning. Wonder when DIR will accept a "better" way to assemble gear? I use stainless wire and then a zip tie over the top of it to make double sure it will hold.

It does take a tiny bit of skill to learn how tight to twist the safety wire to make a secure connection for the mouth piece. As for the BC hose, there HAS to be a better clamping technology than zip ties.

 

[b1gcountry]

How do you keep the wire from cutting your lip?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

The wire is carefully bent over away from the mouth when the twist is done, plus as I mentioned, I often place a zip tie over the wire, so it is pretty much invisible.

 

[PfcAJ]

Can you remove that without special tools?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Removal of stainless safety wire takes a few moments using pliers, vice grips, dikes, needle nose pliers or a leatherman, I suppose. Probably the same tool you would use to remove a zip tie (that is if you didn't want to cut the crap out of your hand with a knife when the zip tie finally slices through suddenly)

 

[JeffG]

There is very little stress on the zip ties that hold mouth pieces or bc inflators. I don't see a reason to change them. They have never broken.