Cancun Still the place for Texans

[mediumone]

United doesn't hate divers. It hates airlines like Southwest, Sun Country, and Spirit, which force it to compete based upon price on flights to Cancun (but not to Cozumel).

I think the airlines have the same thoughts about Spirit as most travelers, which is if you want to fly Spirit, be my guest.

 

[Dave Dillehay]

just got e mail confirmation from United for Cancun to Houston (IAH) next Friday. $66 in taxes and fees. United gets just $60—crazy!


dave

 

[cvchief]

I, too would jump for joy if Southwest started to fly into Cozumel, but knowing what I do about its model for remaining profitable as a low cost carrier, I doubt that will happen anytime soon. Southwest gets much of its cost advantages over other carriers from two important characteristics:

(1) Southwest relies upon its quick turnaround of planes (it gets anywhere from 20%-40% more air time for its planes than any other carrier, a significant advantage when airplanes are the single biggest capital cost for airlines), which requires modern baggage handling capabilities and Southwest's ability to control its own baggage handlers. That in turn requires a schedule of a minimum of 6-10 scheduled landings and departures a day. That simply isn't possible at a place like Cozumel, and even IF Southwest could justify such a schedule at Cozumel, its hard to see the Cozumel Airport investing in the necessary baggage handling equipment or giving up control over the employment of baggage handlers to allow Southwest to achieve an average turnaround time - 45 minutes or less - necessary for Southwest to maintain its cost advantage on use of capital equipment.

(2) Southwest gets a lot of advantage over other airlines by maintaining a high load factor. If you discount all of your seats, as Southwest does, you have to make it up on volume, maintaining a load factor (paying passengers/seats) at over 70% on domestic flights, preferably much more on international flights. Sure, Southwest might be able to maintain an 80%+ load factor on 1-2 flights per day into Cozumel, but if Southwest expanded its schedule to Cozumel to 6-8 flights per day (see point 1 above), it could never keep its load factor high enough on all of those flights to justify a big price advantage over the other carriers.

Conditions might change, but I just don't see Southwest opting to expand operations into Cozumel until they do.

P.S. Just checked Southwest's operating statistics. It would have to plan for an average load factor of 86% or greater for a minimum of 8-10 takeoffs and landings each day to justify flying into Cozumel. Does anyone think that is reasonable to expect for Cozumel?

Just a question. Are you saying they need 6-8 flights to make paying the baggage handlers worthwhile?

They do quick turnaround for sure. We flew out Thursday and that plane dumped a load, we got on and off we went. The attendant we were talking to said she always tries to get the BWI CUN run. A quick down and back and home in time for dinner. They do usually seem to have the flight pretty full, but Thursday was only about 2/3 maybe?

 

[cvchief]

just got e mail confirmation from United for Cancun to Houston (IAH) next Friday. $66 in taxes and fees. United gets just $60—crazy!


dave

You know the whole tax thing is weird. We fly SW and ask for the refund on MX taxes for our PR cards. We get around $25 back per person per trip. The missus took a cheap trip with the girls and flew United. She hated it, but it was into Coz and cheap. However, when I asked them for her MX taxes back, they returned like $60 and for everyone, not just the missus who had the PR card. Made them REALLY cheap....

 

[DjDiverDan]

Just a question. Are you saying they need 6-8 flights to make paying the baggage handlers worthwhile?

Southwest likes to control its own baggage handlers - it pays them well, but works them hard. In order to employ and pay a full time crew of baggage handlers that will unload an arriving plane and load the same plane for departure all within 45-50 minutes, so it can achieve a turnaround time of an hour or less, 8 turnarounds per day, 5 days a week, would account for a tad less than 35 hours a week. Sure, Southwest could just use the baggage handlers employed and paid by the Airport, and not worry about how many turnarounds it did per day or per week, but then it loses control over those employees, and can't prevent them from taking their sweet time to turn a plane around.

BTW, the same logic applies to the Ground Crew. While the baggage handlers are unloading and reloading the plane for turnaround, the Ground Crew is cleaning the cabin, restocking the galley, inspecting the plane, refueling, cleaning the windshield, etc., everything necessary to prepare for a new bunch of passengers and another takeoff. In a domestic airport used by Southwest, it employs its own Ground Crew. Without that minimum number of landing-takeoff cycles per day, Southwest couldn't do that at Cozumel.

 

[cvchief]

Southwest likes to control its own baggage handlers - it pays them well, but works them hard. In order to employ and pay a full time crew of baggage handlers that will unload an arriving plane and load the same plane for departure all within 45-50 minutes, so it can achieve a turnaround time of an hour or less, 8 turnarounds per day, 5 days a week, would account for a tad less than 35 hours a week. Sure, Southwest could just use the baggage handlers employed and paid by the Airport, and not worry about how many turnarounds it did per day or per week, but then it loses control over those employees, and can't prevent them from taking their sweet time to turn a plane around.

BTW, the same logic applies to the Ground Crew. While the baggage handlers are unloading and reloading the plane for turnaround, the Ground Crew is cleaning the cabin, restocking the galley, inspecting the plane, refueling, cleaning the windshield, etc., everything necessary to prepare for a new bunch of passengers and another takeoff. In a domestic airport used by Southwest, it employs its own Ground Crew. Without that minimum number of landing-takeoff cycles per day, Southwest couldn't do that at Cozumel.

I wonder if that is true in Cancun? I always thought for the most part they were all ASUR employees who put on different shirts for each airline. I am thinking some of the check in people were wearing green airport shirts, not just SW stuff. I figure that they have a ton of flights into CUN though. There are usually 2 non-stops outta BWI and then a handful of connecting.

Interesting. Maybe just one non-stop BWI to CZM, you know, to try it out....

 

[nihildriven]

Today i checked for one way CZM to Houston (IAH) on United Sept. 30. $338. Cancun to Houston (IAH) $107. Why does United hate Divers?

Dave

I think others explained this well, but the short answer is it doesn't, and it's complicated.

I recommend flying into Cancun and either taking MayAir to CZM ($63 one way), or doing the bag drag and using it as an opportunity to hit a few cenotes.

 

[nihildriven]

Over flying directly into Cozumel? Not for this traveler, but DSFDF.

Over doing the bag drag and not diving the cenotes.

 

[cvchief]

I think others explained this well, but the short answer is it doesn't, and it's complicated.

I recommend flying into Cancun and either taking MayAir to CZM ($63 one way), or doing the bag drag and using it as an opportunity to hit a few cenotes.

We come down by ferry and return by Mayair. If you buy the Mayair ticket, you can get it at the office by the Ched for like $45 for a tourist.

 

[blue steal]

I would love to do Mayair but with 80+ pounds of stuff it would cost me a fortune. I may just bring as much stuff as Dandy Don.