BP/W DM Course??
- Thread starter Mike.D
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The point is also to judge the candidate's level of comfort in a stressful situation.
Agencies besides have other ways of gauging this. Some have candidates practice a breathold swim before donning their gear underwater or go down to 10m, hold your breath for 1 minute before signaling ok to an examiner then heading back up in a "comfortable" manner.
Agencies besides have other ways of gauging this. Some have candidates practice a breathold swim before donning their gear underwater or go down to 10m, hold your breath for 1 minute before signaling ok to an examiner then heading back up in a "comfortable" manner.
From the PADI Instructor Manual (bold and underline by me)
To score a 5:
Its used to evaluate the student. It's been there forever and I don't see any need to change it. Its a valid today as it was I did it 10 years ago. If the student can't do it, then they are not ultra-comfortable in the water.
An OW student can remove and replace their equipment. DM's should be beyond that.
It's also about working with another diver to solve a problem in a stressful situation. Doffing/donning your own gear doesn't do that. Also - as pointed out above - doffing/donning your own gear is a requirement for an OW student during the CW portion of training before they've even been in OW. A DM should be well beyond that.
To keep the equipment exchange "drift" going, my partner had larger feet than me and wore boots with open heel fins. I wear full foot fins in the pool. That was fun...visualize it.
I wear a prescription mask (+6 in each side). That was fun too.....he just about puked after putting on my mask....even though he only had to swim a little bit with it on.
"Unusual circumstances" to be sure.
I wear a prescription mask (+6 in each side). That was fun too.....he just about puked after putting on my mask....even though he only had to swim a little bit with it on.
"Unusual circumstances" to be sure.
My YMCA/NAUI crossover classes had me assisting when open water students were doing gear exchanges, leaving one set of gear in one corner of the pool and swimming to another set, donning it, taking 4 or 5 breaths, leave it and swim back to the original gear worn.
DMC's and DM crossovers had to leave everything including masks and fins. Only thing we could keep was our weightbelts.
I do gear exchanges in the open water class with air shares. However if students want to try it buddy breathing they are free to once we've finished all the other required skills.
DMC's and DM's also had to do the leave the mask, snorkel, fins in the deep end under a pool brick, surface, swim 40 ft away, then from that spot execute a surface dive, swim underwater to the gear, put everything on and have the mask clear and snorkel breathable before your head cleared the surface so that you were breathing from the snorkel without picking your head up out of the water. That was a real task loading exercise that required planning, control of stress level, and being able to relax under pressure. I was so set on doing it the first time in the exam that when I felt myself rising as I was still donning the mask after putting the fins on that I kicked down deeper to make sure I would not have to repeat it.
My IT said he never saw anyone do that before. Usually they just stayed allowed themselves to rise and try to control it and tried to keep from lifting their head. The idea was that you didn't send up a huge spout of water from the snorkel once you surfaced. It was supposed to already be clear by then so that as soon as the top broke the surface you could inhale. I practiced that one a lot. Still like to do it at the end of my snorkel/skin diving lessons I teach two nights a week to 8yr olds and up. I have some of them starting to try it now.
DMC's and DM crossovers had to leave everything including masks and fins. Only thing we could keep was our weightbelts.
I do gear exchanges in the open water class with air shares. However if students want to try it buddy breathing they are free to once we've finished all the other required skills.
DMC's and DM's also had to do the leave the mask, snorkel, fins in the deep end under a pool brick, surface, swim 40 ft away, then from that spot execute a surface dive, swim underwater to the gear, put everything on and have the mask clear and snorkel breathable before your head cleared the surface so that you were breathing from the snorkel without picking your head up out of the water. That was a real task loading exercise that required planning, control of stress level, and being able to relax under pressure. I was so set on doing it the first time in the exam that when I felt myself rising as I was still donning the mask after putting the fins on that I kicked down deeper to make sure I would not have to repeat it.
My IT said he never saw anyone do that before. Usually they just stayed allowed themselves to rise and try to control it and tried to keep from lifting their head. The idea was that you didn't send up a huge spout of water from the snorkel once you surfaced. It was supposed to already be clear by then so that as soon as the top broke the surface you could inhale. I practiced that one a lot. Still like to do it at the end of my snorkel/skin diving lessons I teach two nights a week to 8yr olds and up. I have some of them starting to try it now.
ams511
Contributor
So you are telling me that this exercise was probably put into place when the typical gear configuration was a double-hose regulator, a backpack holding the tanks and maybe a horsecollar BC. A time when fit issues were generally pretty minor, a leaky mask, loose or cramped fins. What does PADI suggest when 2 DMCs have a large difference in physical size, say a petite female and a large athletic male? It may be physically impossible for the man to fit in her BC.
In education, teachers usually train their students in real life skills, not made up exercises designed to stress them. The exception is the military.
'Suck it up' maybe?
I had be the 2nd for a DMC's equipment exchange and she was markedly smaller than me. And I'm pretty small. I could get her BC on but couldn't really fasten it, and there was no hope with her fins so I stuck them under my armpit and dealt with it.
Like, I don't know...... solving a problem
ams511
Contributor
'Suck it up' maybe?
I had be the 2nd for a DMC's equipment exchange and she was markedly smaller than me. And I'm pretty small. I could get her BC on but couldn't really fasten it, and there was no hope with her fins so I stuck them under my armpit and dealt with it.
Like, I don't know...... solving a problem
I am sorry but I find your explanations unsatisfactory. First, the "been in requirements forever" is not justification but rather an excuse. A real educational organization reviews its curriculum periodically to make sure it is still relevant and that real word skills are taught. As an instructor I would not expect you to do this but someone in PADI HQ should. Second, I do not see you solving a problem, I see you creating one by donning ill fitting gear. Also why not put the fins on your hands and do the breast stroke? It is near impossible to move underwater in full kit without fins on your feet.
If you want a candidate to perform under stressful circumstances I am sure you can think up more relevant exercises than a gear swap. I am sure Jim L. could have his OW students do it if he pared them up according to size.
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