The value of PADI

[Jim Lapenta]

When my students leave my class they are fully capable of planning a dive with a buddy of equal or greater skill and following that plan. Part of that planning includes knowing when not to make a dive due to conditions, personal comfort level, available air supply, and training and experience. There is no reason for anyone to do trust me dives.

There are enough dive locations that anyone with any real training can pick a place that is within their skill level and dive. Too often new divers are not told that not doing a dive can be a more valuable learning experience than blindly following a DM or Guide.

I want to know depth, temp, current ,and compass direction to a few key spots. After that I'll decide what interests me and dive MY plan. This is what I teach my students to be prepared for. And why I love diving in the Keys where there is no DM in the water.

Turning an OW diver loose who cannot follow a basic compass direction, decide that the spot is too deep or current too strong, or know that they have enough air for the dive is not acceptable to me. There is no excuse for a person with a C card to need a DM to tell them how much weight they need, find the way back to the boat or shore, or know when it's time to head back.

This all covered in my dive planning lecture, tables lecture, and environment lecture. Whether it is laziness, incompetence, greed, so-called time constraints, or other excuse given makes no difference. If an OW diver cannot plan and execute a dive with a buddy independent of a DM they are not ready to be certified. If one recognizes that due to a new spot, different yet still safe conditions, or specifically looking for an item or critter then by all means hire a DM. But do not expect that it is a given. New divers need to be made fully aware that ultimately they and they alone are responsible for their safety, comfort, and success at this sport.

 

[scubafritz]

There are tons of people that learn things just long enough to pass a test. Avoid them like the plague, it is obvious to me that you are a better diver than the buddy you have described.
Pick a buddy that shows thought to safety and is more careful, I would rather dive with someone that is too careful.

 

[PuddleDiver78]

The thing about padi i that you can do OW and AOW together with no extra dive between the too.
I whose a NAUI AOW ( have the same program as PADI) and now I'm a SSI dive con and the way that their program works is to advance in levels you need to have the number of dives thy request and some time specialty course's.
In my opinion i think that the ssi program is good because you cant advance with out experience.
And it is important to have a instructor that will fail students if they don't meet requirement's.

I agree

 

[RonFrank]

I don't think Adventures in Diving is going anywhere. It isn't discussed or offered anywhere around here. OW, AOW, Rescue - that's the sequence.

Richard

At our local shop they call it "A-1's ADVENTURE DIVER AND ADVANCED COURSES". The Adventure diver IS what everyone calls AOW.

This is not because PADI is not trying to take the emphasis off Advanced, but because Scuba Shops don't share the same philosophy as PADI. I guess folks like to THINK they are taking Advanced training.

My thought is that if someone's dives 6~10 are called *advanced*, that is hardly the case. I think PADI agrees with this line of thought.

If you are a PADI shop, look at the AOW training material. It does not say Advanced Open Water anywhere in it that I found. My material is from 2003, so things may have changed, but not based on A1's current course description.

 

[Dance4God]

I have AOW certification, but I feel far from Advanced. I only have 20 dives (7 of those are in Hawaii, the rest in PNW). I am still getting the hang of relaxing, buoyancy, etc. I can go to 100ft, but prefer to stay around 40-80 ft to practice my skills. My husband is more advanced than I and is my buddy. He likes to go further, but will stick to my wishes when we dive together. He has a buddy who is a DM if he wants to go further down and do something more adventurous. I am not going to take anymore specialty courses except Peak until I am totally comfortable with what I do now. I'd love to dive with more advanced divers here, but I don't want to hold them back either....So, yeah, it is just a card to me until I'm ready for the Advanced stuff!

 

[Walter]

If you are a PADI shop, look at the AOW training material. It does not say Advanced Open Water anywhere in it that I found.

What does it say on the card PADI sends you?

 

[Standingbear56]

It's Advanced OPEN WATER Diver NOT Advanced Diver. Sheesh!

Well, it's NOT advanced confined water now it is? (well with PADI's new confined water it just might be) Double Sheesh!

 

[RonFrank]

Wow, the card does say "Advanced Open Water Diver".

Well, I'm proud to know I was "Advanced" after so few dives!

 

[NudeDiver]

I recall from my OW course that instructor told us with emphasis "In the conditions you were trained".....Then I did my first open ocean dive off a boat in 82*F water with 100' vis...I was nervous as hell, nervous to do a true free decent into the blue abyss, nervous to go down to 60'. Why? Because that was not the conditions I was trained in, although they were nicer conditions, I needed/desired/obtained supervision there till I got used to things.

Wow - I'm really surprised that you would say that.

I certified in very cold, slushy, dark waters (think Alaska in November), in a drysuit (about +40F). I did my 4 dives in Prince William Sound from the shore. A month later, I went to Australia - was not at all nervous about boat diving in its nice, warm, toasty and clear waters on a perfect summer day. Not at all. I can't imagine why I would be. Had I been nervous to dive in those conditions, I would have felt really ripped off by my OW class.

I think the statement "In the conditions you were trained" is really better stated as something along the lines of , "..the conditions in which you were trained, or easier/less challenging/better". After all, if you take and pass an Algebra II class, one should reasonably be able to assume you can do Algebra I level work, even though you didn't take that class.

Personally, I feel that if an instructor is not training OW students to the level at which they can dive independently, with a buddy, in the same or easier conditions in which their students are certified, then that instructor should find a new line of work - and his/her students are not getting what they paid for.

 

[rstofer]

At our local shop they call it "A-1's ADVENTURE DIVER AND ADVANCED COURSES". The Adventure diver IS what everyone calls AOW.

This is not because PADI is not trying to take the emphasis off Advanced, but because Scuba Shops don't share the same philosophy as PADI. I guess folks like to THINK they are taking Advanced training.

Well, when you look at it that way, you're kind of correct. The book is "Adventures in Diving Manual" and it lists a series of adventure dives. There are various ways to use the book as most of the Specialties also use it.

But, on page vii after it describes the Adventure Diver program is says:

After the PADI Adventure Diver course is the PADI Advanced Open Water Diver certification. For the Advanced Open Water Diver certification, you'll complete the Underwater Navigation and Deep Adventure Dives and three other Adventure Dives that you and your instructor decide on. You can go directly from Open Water Diver to Advanced Open Water Diver, but if you already have the Adventure Diver certification, those dives may count toward your Advanced Open Water Diver certification.

So, PADI seem to be ambivalent about the Adventure Diver program. It's there if anybody is interested but there's no reason to get interested because the very same dives are used for the Advanced Open Water certification.

Now, we can go one step further: we need 5 specialties for the Master Scuba Diver recognition award. It turns out that the dives made in Advanced Open Water can count toward one of the required dives for each of the related specialties. And, apparently, some of the specialties that count toward the MSD award don't require getting wet: Equipment Specialist and Nitrox come to mind.

Richard