Suggestion Wow...

[Aquabella]

So that's how it happens...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiip...

I don't know if that was a very effective solution guys...kinda ups the PO'dness on my part.

 

[DeepScuba]

yabbutt hasn't it been confirmed than a few banned folks have no idea why they are banned?

 

[SterlingDiver]

.........take it for what it is worth, maybe to you, not much, but I guess I will risk it.

I had a wise business mentor in life that taught me that in any given situation you can discount about 1/3 of what others are presenting because of their paradigm or "spin" vs. reality. As I have followed all the threads dealing with this "banned" subject I think this rule applies quite well.

With that said, I enjoy this board as a place of recreation and entertainment. I have even enjoyed the exposure to the banner adds after the change. All of this keeps me in touch with a hobby I love and helps me feel apart of something that is a limited activity because I am 2,000 miles from the nearest ocean and have incredible time demands placed on me. I'm the guy that a gets couple of dive trips a year with my family at great expense and sacrifice. Sometimes I even learn something here, which is a bonus! Still to me this is recreation and fun.

What, has been going on here (SB) the last two days, is not enjoyable, nor does it meet my needs of participation here. I hope all this discord is temporary.

As far as what is acceptable behavior or not on (SB) I haven't yet seen alot of explantion of that. I know I can read the TOS, but every board has "culture" of acceptable behavior by it's community.

I have been a victim of SeaJay's flames a few times. I never got too upset over his flames or any other's. Sometimes their point of view has influenced me, for the better. I figure as an adult I can withstand a little heat. So as far as "moderation" goes, less is better. I don't need protection from strong personalities like SeaJay, in fact, sometimes they make the board interesting. If I ever feel threatened I can always leave the sight.

Anyway, the interesting thing is, I think most of the 20k participants understand these simple things and if the board unravels because of this, I am confident that another will pop-up and take its place. I know I will only give it a few more trys before I get weary of the banter of both sides.

Thanks to all who make this a fun, interesting place, including the "banned", moderators, and those feeling injured right now.

Snow and Fogged in,

SterlingDiver

 

[DennisS]

Interesting, what was the thread thats causing such a tempest in the teacup

 

[Ontario Diver]

OTOH, I know Pete personally and he has earned my respect and trust. I have every confidence that he is looking into this situation and that he will be fair. I trust this man with my life. If there is a problem, someone mentioned a "a rogue moderator", Pete will find it and fix it.

I second this feeling. Lets give Pete a chance to figure out what went on.

Let's also get some basic points nailed down.

Scubaboard is a private place. We are all here as Pete's guests and as such must abide by his rules. There are no "Fifth Ammendment Rights". There are no legal options if you don't like the rules. But there is another side to this, and that is that the board must stay a place where divers like to visit and as such there are good reasons to keep the rules to a minimum.

I don't think that anyone is questioning Scubaboard's right to restrict access. I think that there is more concern about whether "due process" is followed. By the way, by "due process" I mean Scubaboard's own stated processes. None of us want to believe that the bannings were arbitrary or motivated by personality issues, but based on TOS infractions.

A second point has been made. One of Scubaboard's policies is that banning issues will not be discussed in a "public" forum. Some questions have arisen to the benefits of that rule . By acknowledging banning publically, moderators provide feedback on acceptable and not acceptable behaviour. Also as was said by Louis X!V - "It is not enough for the Queen to be pure - she must be seen to be pure." It is difficult to accept someone telling you - What I did was right but I'm not allowed to discuss it. That requires a large amount of trust which must be earned. This is why courts are open to the public. This is why every time someone is fired from a company there is an acknowledgement by management. Granted it will not state that "Bob is a thief" but it will state that "Bob's employment was terminated with cause after a police investigation."

Now, we have no right to expect Scubaboard to change, nor should we expect perfection. But by raising points that concern us, we show that we care about the board. Pete's attempt to address them shows that he understands that. Let's give him some time to formulate a response that will solve these issues.

 

[Ted S]

As for Medic13, that account is showing up with full permissions under the registered user group so I would imagine any login problems are related to some other issue.

 

[diverbrian]

I have had no problems with Pete. Not wanting to drag down and copy the TOS, I went through that section last night when this thread was running at white heat.

Some of the people that are mentioned did persist in "non-family friendly" posts on this board. I was able to see that without moderators pulling threads.

As to others not knowing why they were banned, maybe they haven't opened that e-mail account yet. Heck, I don't even know if one of the primary e-mail addresses that I used in the "early days" is still active. I found a way to "spam proof" my mailbox by moving to a new one. That is what I did. In any case, it is between them and SB management. Walter placed a good example of "he said...., she said...." on here already. I am sure that the information in those e-mails was given to a friend to be shared as friends. It may not have been intended for public use.

Most of my good friends on the board, I have names, addresses, and phone numbers for. I talk to them by phone or personal e-mail. I seldom use the PM system on this board or thread to communicate with them. There are a couple of exceptions but not many.

As to the work issue that I brought up, my plant has 120 people (down quite a bit due to downsizing), including management. They have terminated the employment of three people that I can think of off-hand in about 4 years. Firings are NOT a common occurence. And yes, we normally find out more about the reasons from the former employees than from the manangement, who simply tell us "so-and-so has had their employment terminated. If you see them around the plant, please notify security and do not let them in." And like bannings here, it takes an exceedingly long "laundry list" to get someone fired or an EXTREMELY serious occurence (like a racist threat, which our company has zero tolerance for).

I would imagine that someone banned from here would know that they have had "one foot over the grave, and the other on a banana peel" for a little while.

I don't want to know the private issues that get people banned. I am normally one of the last to know that anyone has been banned. As Pete says, take a look at the membership numbers. The number of people banned has been quite low in that regard. If there was some great conspiracy, this thread would have already been pulled.

Let's let the moderators deal with the moderating. I know that our friends will still be our friends, regardless of whether or not they can post on this board or not!

 

[Ted S]

This is quite a concern - you said "no one has been banned for asking questions," yet I had not one but two threads pulled for simply 'asking questions.' So, to clarify - you can't be banned, but you can have your stuff yanked??? Or is it more complicated than that?

I merely want to play by the rules so that the same fate doesn't befall me as befell Cobaltbabe or Raven. So, for the boards benefit - may you please clarify that for everyone?

Simply having a thread removed does not mean you will be banned. Users could have 1 thread pulled and get a ban (spam advertisers) or have 5 threads pulled and remain active users. What is important is the nature of the threads and generally the chat that goes on around them (between the member and a mod via PM or email). Please remember that pulling a thread takes seconds but having a dicussion about it and contacting the user may take a bit longer, the moderators need to all get on the same page before action is taken and that can mean some time dicussing what was done and how to handle it. As a genderal rule you should have recieved a few warnings prior to a ban but that may not always happen.

 

[divedude]

Fortunately, the First Amendment doesn't apply to this Board.

Unfortunately "Freedom of speech is only free, if the powers that be, let it."
And thats not just on this board :crying2:

 

[divedude]

Some one even pulled the "Tech Admin" post

 

[Ted S]

I just wanted to bring up one small point that people have overlooked and I think should make some of you happy. Back before our upgrade (and under the old system) this board worked as a self-contained unit, PMs were the only form of contact the board allowed and, while you could get contact information from other people it was setup to be very hard to do so. One of the big changes NetDoc made was letting users choose their own level of privacy, email addresses are never made public but users can decide to let others talk to them directly without PMs and without the board.

This may not be a huge issue for most of you but it is a sign of the direction the board has taken; many things have changed over the years, most of the changes you see now were thought up on day one but never got implemented until late in the game and some of them are brand new based on the direction that you have all taken the board in. One thing is for sure, we value your feedback and your contribution to the community. We hope you understand that the decisions made by the moderators are not meant to take away from your experience here, but are simply what the moderators feel is best for ScubaBoard under the TOS and under our mission statement/ values.