Why breathe from a long hose?

[btroxell]

I’m not trying to start a DIR-bashing thread but I have been considering taking the Fundies or the Essentials class (and watching that thead) but I have a problem with the long hose requirement.
The way I understand it, you donate the regulator you are breathing from because you know it’s good and then switch to the one you have not been using. I have taken many 1st Aid classes and over-lying tenet is to make sure you are safe. If you are not sure that the regulator you are not breathing from does not work properly, why would you switch to it? Even if that’s not the main reason, why not configure the regulator you are not breathing from with a long hose and donate that one? Actually, I have been thinking of swapping out my secondary regulator with a 5’ hose to make it easier to donate (and always keeping my primary in my mouth). But this is not the approved configuration for the classes.
So to reiterate, why do you donate the ‘working’ regulator and put yourself in possible jeopardy?

Ben

 

[TSandM]

You are far less stressed than the person to whom you are donating -- you have time to find your backup reg, and if it breathes a little wet or something, you are in a much better place to cope with that.

Donating the reg you are breathing is also lightning fast -- unlike fumbling for a reg secured elsewhere. And the long hose configuration permits easy reestablishment of your configuration, once the emergency is over -- and the most likely reason for donating to someone else using a long hose setup is a temporary problem involving gas switches or shutoffs. Some people used to use a long hose that was folded and bungied to the tank, but it was almost impossible to restow underwater (and that impedes practicing with it, too!)

People often fret over the idea of giving up your regulator and having none, but with a backup bungied under your chin, the likelihood of having a problem retrieving a regulator is almost zero.

 

[Gombessa]

Hi Ben,

It sounds like your question is less about the length of the donating hose, and more about why you donate the primary reg.

While there are other reasons to do so, a few of the main ones are here:

1. You're not the one in with an emergency. If you get an OOG signal, you have a small amount of time to react - whether that's swimming to the OOG diver or just before you donate - you can take a breath and know that you have up to a minute or more to sort things out if you need to, whereas the OOG buddy may not. That makes donating the reg you're breathing easier to stomach. I understand this logic continues to hold if you need to donate while using multiple cylinders--you need to make sure the OOG diver gets the right gas for the right depth, and you have a few seconds to work out any issues for yourself.

2. Your backup is right under your chin. Even if you give up the primary, you always know where the backup is. You never need to hunt for it or worry if it's fallen out of its "octo holder" and is dangling behind you. In a pinch, you may even be able to reach it without using your hands (though that's not the trained response).

3. An OOG diver who is panicked is likely going to grab the regulator out of your mouth rather than look around your body for a tucked octo. By learning to donate the primary, the trained response matches the panic reaction. When I'm diving with someone unfamiliar with my setup, I always tell them that if they go OOG, they can signal as usual, or just grab the regulator out of my mouth, since I've trained for that.

To me, a lot of this boiled down to good common sense. Even in my first OW class, I was never comfortable with the whole "golden triangle" concept I was taught or with the idea that you'd have to fight against the likely panic response. It seemed more reasonable for me to be able to go for my own octo if an emergency happened, rather than require someone else to find it.

Best,
Kenn

 

[fobturbo]

Ben,

As part of the pre-dive check, each diver makes sure that both their regs are working properly. Granted, something can always happen to the secondary once the dive is underway...during my OW class, we were taught about the golden triangle, but my instructor also told us that a panicked diver may just grab the primary out of your mouth since they have a reasonable chance that it works. The thought of this really made me check often that my octo was clipped in and secured at all times

As far as the long hose goes, in some environments, swimming side by side is not possible (i.e. narrow wreck corridors) and the long hose is more useful in such situations.

 

[Web Monkey]

I’m not trying to start a DIR-bashing thread but I have been considering taking the Fundies or the Essentials class (and watching that thead) but I have a problem with the long hose requirement.
The way I understand it, you donate the regulator you are breathing from because you know it’s good and then switch to the one you have not been using. I have taken many 1st Aid classes and over-lying tenet is to make sure you are safe. If you are not sure that the regulator you are not breathing from does not work properly, why would you switch to it? Even if that’s not the main reason, why not configure the regulator you are not breathing from with a long hose and donate that one?

The primary reason for the "long hose" is because the OOA diver might be in a restriction of some sort that prevents meeting face-to-face to share air (cave, wreck, swimthough, etc.).

Most of the other part of your question has been answered. The only thing I'll add is that knowing that the backup reg is for you in an emergency, you might tend to buy a good reg and take care of it.

If you don't trust that your backup is 100% fully functional, you shouldn't be in the water with it, since you're just trolling for a fatality (maybe you, maybe the OOA diver).

Terry

 

[pacificgal]

I thought it also had something to do with being able to keep a safe distance from a panicked diver? Then again, if they bolt up with your reg in their mouth, you'll be coming 7' later...

 

[Hinalo]

If I donated a second stage to someone having an OOG emergency in open water, long or short hose, I'd also hold onto them so I could control bouyancy for the both of us.

 

[pacificgal]

I'm not sure I could hold someone down that wanted to go up. Is there a technique?

 

[Jasonmh]

I thought it also had something to do with being able to keep a safe distance from a panicked diver? Then again, if they bolt up with your reg in their mouth, you'll be coming 7' later...

No, the 7 foot hose has nothing to do with wanting to put extra distance between you and the panicked diver. The 7 foot hose does not preclude anyone from keeping a hold of a panicked diver if required, and it also provides extra room to manouver, allows for each person to better manage their equipment and bouyancy, and allows for traveling in multiple configurations to exit the water, if required. For me, an air share with a 7 foot hose is much easier than with a standard hose configuration.

 

[Teamcasa]

I commend you for wanting to take the class. You will no doubt be a better diver for it.

A long hose configuration is a well thought out, well tested method for donating air to another diver and very useful for confined space air sharing.

As to your concern about giving up your working reg, the below is perfect.

If you don't trust that your backup is 100% fully functional, you shouldn't be in the water with it,

Take the class, follow their recommendations, learn the skills and then decide for yourself if diving with a long hose has a value for your diving.