Why are so many female divers codependent?

[TSandM]

I manage anything I really want to do. In Mexico, in May, I was trying to climb a set of stairs up from a dive site in my doubles, and got to one that was simply too high for me to negotiate. I tried a couple of times, at different points along the stair, but there was nothing to grab and pull, and I couldn't step up. So I crawled. It worked; it wasn't pretty. Had any of my buddies been nearby (they had already climbed the stairs and were headed across the parking lot, and didn't see my troubles) I would have asked for a hand. On a subsequent dive there, I warned them ahead of time and asked them to stay with me to help.

Then I came home and hit the gym; I walked up those stairs next time.

But is there really anything wrong with acknowledging that someone is stronger than you are? Whether it's a woman acknowledging that in a man, or a man admitting it about a woman? And if someone is stronger than you are, is there anything wrong with accepting assistance when it makes your life easier?

Overall, one of the hardest lessons for me in diving has been accepting help. I need help zipping my drysuit (can't get the last 2 cm or so done by myself). Sometimes I need help if I have something badly twisted when I'm gearing up; I can always fix it by getting out of the gear, but that's often not the most efficient way to deal with the problem. I often need a brief hand for balance in getting out of the water. I cannot afford to fall; after 23 fractures and six operations, I have no desire whatsoever to break anything else in my whole life.

I think your approach to life is warped if you play helpless and have the "big old strong MAN" help you with things you don't need help with. But I think you're equally off base if you can't accept any help with ANYTHING because it would mean that somehow, the man who helps you has trumped you in some way. JMHO.

 

[Sas]

But is there really anything wrong with acknowledging that someone is stronger than you are? Whether it's a woman acknowledging that in a man, or a man admitting it about a woman? And if someone is stronger than you are, is there anything wrong with accepting assistance when it makes your life easier?

Not at all. I am always happy to accept help off people who are stronger and to offer help to those that are weaker. But gender does not matter to me for either of those scenarios. I do like to know that I can do things on my own if need be though... that is part of the reason why I work out at the gym. I like to be able to carry my own scuba gear as if my buddy is not around to help then I am on my own until I get to the boat

 

[Ana]

But is there really anything wrong with acknowledging that someone is stronger than you are? Whether it's a woman acknowledging that in a man, or a man admitting it about a woman? And if someone is stronger than you are, is there anything wrong with accepting assistance when it makes your life easier?

Not at all. I am always happy to accept help off people who are stronger and to offer help to those that are weaker. But gender does not matter to me for either of those scenarios. I do like to know that I can do things on my own if need be though... that is part of the reason why I work out at the gym. I like to be able to carry my own scuba gear as if my buddy is not around to help then I am on my own until I get to the boat

These two statements hold what I consider the key of what I believe. Offering and receiving assistance should not be dependent of gender.

 

[fairybasslet]

TSandM - Thank you. You put it better than I ever could. (Although you are very close to a very unpopular opinion right now).

I beg to differ. What TS&M was saying is diametrically opposed to what you are advocating. I hope a good night's sleep and looking at your posts and hers with a fresh perspective will show you just how different your two approaches to the situation really are.

 

[Cacia]

I like the idea of getting men to do whatever you can get them to do.

That is stronger isn't it? lol...sorry

children included....delegate, delegate.

I walked up those stairs next time.

I know how you feel! I can make it up Mountain Ave, coming out of the Rose Bowl now (bike) THAT has not been pretty to passerbys. We are only up against ourselves, in the end. If I had a man my age, I could look better.

 

[Soakedlontra]

Hello folks! I am a beginner who after about two years of scuba diving 'brainwashing' from my husband I finally decided to get certified. I have been a swimmer and snorkeler since I was a kid so I did not make that decision because he wanted me to become his buddy only, but because it felt 'natural' too.

I do admit that I am not an expert in mechanics and gadgets, but with time and some patience I eventually familiarized myself with the gear and I deal with my own gear as much as I can. I ask for help when I feel I cannot figure out things for myself first.

After 11 dives with my husband-buddy some problems are beginning to emerge. I am realizing that I am still dependent on him regarding keeping track of time, navigation, being aware of depth and when to stop for a safety stop. Part of the problem is due to the fact that I do not have my own gauges, compass and computer. I am still renting that stuff so by 'default' my husband is the one that leads the dive, whether I like it or not.

On top of that sometimes he cannot help himself to be a bit 'patronizing' and make derogatory remarks when I ask him questions that apparently seem rather dumb to him (lately it was about the dive plan). In these situations we end up bickering in a negative way that makes us stress out and put us in a foul mood (definitively not a good way to begin a dive!). Usually after venting out the stress and getting into the water we are able to relate to each other like two equal human beings again and the dive proceeds without too much trouble.

We are very open with each other and don’t have a problem to discuss what goes wrong. We tend to be a bit stubborn and I realize that I cannot totally blame him for his attitude. We both have to work to improve how we communicate with each other. The fact that we are so close (perhaps too close) makes it difficult for him to see me as one of his other dive buddies and he tends to be extra-protective on one hand and less-‘respectful’ on the other.

I am beginning to feel rather frustrated by his attitude and I wish I could sometimes dive with a different buddy to see things in a different perspective and to improve my confidence as a diver away from his ‘psychological-grip’.

 

[TheWetRookie]

When I dive with the female divers I know ( my wife being one of them) at the start of a dive when we meet, I let them know that I am here to help if they need it, if not no worries and I leave it at that.

As far as the dive planning goes, everyone is treated the same, as a diver, and everyone has a say in the dive plan and the same is applied to the dive itself also.

Then we go and enjoy a nice dive.

 

[Michael Folise]

Afew thoughts based on experience. My daughter was certified at age 12 and has been diving for over three years. She is now about 5' 3" 110 Lbs. but was only about 4' 9" 95 Lbs. when she started. You can see some current pictures of her attached. She had been snorkeling since age 5 and was excited about getting certified. I had not been diving for many years so I re-took the certification course along with her. I thought long and hard about geting her certified at that age and size. Before doing so I consulted with other experienced divers who knew her as well as our instructor. The instructor separated us right from the start. I never helped her with anything. She did it all and our instructor expected her to do so. To this day whether a beach dive or a boat dive we each set up all our own gear, change tanks, etc. Quite frankly I do not believe that she would trust me (or anyone else) to set up her gear. She has discovered and corrected many mistakes I have made in setting up my own gear during buddy checks. She has rethreaded my tank strap and closed the cam buckle underwater after my tank slipped because I had threaded the buckle wrong on shore after adding an accesory to the strap. She actually had to do some fancy bracing aginst my tank to do so. She has never pannicked or given me any cause to belive that she is any less capable as a buddy as someone larger or male with the same level of experience. She insists that we do a loop around each other after reaching the bottom to check for leaks, etc. This caught another mistake I had made when I had cross-threaded my shoulder dump valve on my BCD. We have taken refresher courses every year since she has been certified and recently completed the PADI U/W navigator class. She found the float on the first try after five course changes over 400 feet. It took me until the second try. She enjoys diving immensely but also takes her responsibilties as a buddy seriously. She has indicated a desire to proceed with our training through rescue diver. Her smaller size has not caused me or anyone else to do anything for her-she has simply learned to do things in a different way (technique) to accomodate her smaller size, hand strenght, etc.

After watching her over the years I conclude that to the extent any diver is dependent it is his/her buddy's fault and is a detriment to both of them.

 

[drbill]

"Do unto others..." is really all we need to do. It is the creed of Confucius (even before it became part of the Christian philosophy), and a core tenant of most successful religious thinking. I try to treat others, regardless of gender, the way I would want them to treat me.

Oh, by the way, it rarely works in reverse.

 

[Calle Roo]

Yeah, my ex used to set up my gear, get it on me, take it off, put it in the water, etc but now that he's gone, I had to learn on my own, and Im carrying 2 tanks in each hand with another strapped into my BCD on my back.

Yeah I like being taken care of every now and than, and dont stop my current partner in crime when he gets me set up so we can hit the water quicker.

But I do know I can do it on my own, and put my own physical limitations to the test by giving it a go as opposed to considering what others thought while I looked silly trying to figure it out on my own. Took me awhile, but now I got it.