what do your partners think?

[Bill51]

I have no idea what the concern is. When I climbed regulary, my steady partner for a couple of years was a top female climber. Her husband and my wife were fine with the arrangement. I would expect the same would occur in diving, though I have mostly dove with males. Its not about having sex, its about diving...

I must admit my wife wasn’t impressed when an ex-girlfriend climber and I had an unexpected bivouac on the north ridge of Holy Cross. Honest it really was the weather that caused it. Other than that if it required crampons or anything other than a top belay she didn’t care what gal I was with as long as she didn’t have to go.

 

[scuba41girl]

I'm a newbie to diving but not to marriage counseling. Here's my 2¢ for free:

Maeistero - dive with men, dude! :no

Your fiance is not a diver and doesn't share that social interest with you so she can't come along and be a part. Strike one. She's concerned about your female dive buddies. Strike two. You say she is "understandably" concerned. Strike three. If her concern is understandable to you, then you already know what you need to do as her fiance. Time to step up or step out.

A wise mentor of mine once observed: "In any dynamic team effort involving men and women working together in close proximity with great passion, there is always an undercurrent of eros." That's true even when clothed in neoprene.

If the notion of giving up your female dive buddies bothers you, give up your fiance for her own sake and yours. Better a broken engagement than a bad marriage, believe me. Perhaps the single life would be better suited for you. Then you can dive with whomever you wish, unless of course, your dive buddy's husband is concerned about it. Then she gets the same advice given above.

That's called DIR when it comes to being, and staying, married.

you are very wise obe wan my boyfriend and i have talked about this at length because we are constantly observing other people's relationships as well as our own. it comes down to one thing. if you are upsetting someone you love with your actions, you stop whatever you are doing (unless that person is being irrational...if they are do you stay with them?)

my bf's theory is that it is about threat. if you see someone you love with someone that you think your love may be attracted to, threat plays a part and that's where the jealousy comes in.

we were in a bar with a large group a friends. a guy brought a girl with him (as a friend only) and she got drunk and dryhumped every guy in the place. she even grabbed my bf's crotch. out of respect for me, he has made it clear she is no longer accepted by us because of her lack of class. i know that he would never touch her but i would never accept her diving with him because she made it clear she cannot be trusted. any other girl, i have no problem with...as long as she keeps her hands to herself.

 

[Cacia]

if you are upsetting someone you love with your actions, you stop whatever you are doing (unless that person is being irrational...

well..If you are not doing anything wrong, and have no history of that, then it IS irrational. And, if you allow yourself the shorter and shorter leash, then pretty soon you are in a situation where you have succombed to the other person's insecurities and this only manifests itself in new ways.

You can give that a shot, but don't be surprised if you lose yourself....and I would not want a man that became all overly domesticated anyway. "oh...I can't come out and play...my wife is making me mow the grass"

I say, do the right things and don't play into the unreasonable demands of the other person...they will adjust.

"In any dynamic team effort involving men and women working together in close proximity with great passion, there is always an undercurrent of eros

I say..."so what" Eros is found in everyday life..art, music, nature. I say get over it already and don't be so afraid. If you are acting with integrity, their is no dishonor in a little eros flowing around.

You sound like we might as well just put on the burkhas and be done with it already.

You know, in societies that try and eradicate eros, the behaviors are very aberant. (my opinion, I guess)

The energy of eros can be transformed and rechanneled anyway.

Thomas Moore "Care of the Soul" changed the way I see all this years ago.


DIR relationships? no...thanks.

and personally? Those people giving marriage counseling? Most of them are all messed up...from what I have seen.

 

[ScubaRev]

(unless that person is being irrational...if they are do you stay with them?)

Do not stay with irrational people. It leads to irrational relationships and high maintainance marriages. To quote the daughter of a friend of mine: "Dating is more or less a catch and release program."

Emotionally irrational types aren't keepers. Toss 'em back. Therapy's expensive; money better spent on gear and dive trips.

 

[TSandM]

A funny moment from our class this weekend . . . The instructor is talking through something, and he was illustrating some point by pointing to each of us in turn and saying something along the lines of, "You would look for him, or him, or him -- uh, excuse me, HER." Just reinforced my conviction that, for the majority of divers, this is almost a genderless sport.

 

[Bob_B]

My wife does not dive and even though she has not said anything about me diving with other women, I really don't get the chance that often. We do have a few women divers in our group but most have not moved into the tech diving side that may regular dive buddy and I have. As a matter of fact, I think I have only been on 1 dive, out of 331, where there was just me and a female diver. (my wife was there too).

As with other things that require me to be involved with females, I try not to do the "Mary said this", "Lisa does that" type of thing. I keep the discussion more general and impersonal. My wife seems to like it better that way... (It took me 17 years to figure that out)

The biggest issue is not the gender of my dive buddy but the amount of dive time. I have managed 120 dives this year (from NC to FL) and my wife has not had any major problem with it. I have, however, also learned when not to go diving and go with her..

 

[Darnold9999]

Can't believe a marriage counsellor would give advice to give up your friends to assuage your partners insecurities.

Now if you had a history of straying with female friends and you feel need to be separate from these friends to make sure you never stray then perhaps I might buy this advice. Otherwise I view this as a long term recipie for disaster as your circle of "permitted" activities and "permitted" circle of friends diminish over time.

Of course there is an undercurrent of eros whenever people of the opposite sex interact, its part of what makes us human. It is however what you do with this undercurrent that is the issue. Determine with your partner where the line is that you won't cross and then live with that agreement. If they need that line to be in a place that you can't live with then it is time to move on.

IHMO opinion moving the line to "you can't spend any time doing social things with members of the opposite sex without me" reveals quite a bit about the person making the demand and would be a deal breaker for me.

 

[Surelyshirly]

[/QUOTE]The biggest issue is not the gender of my dive buddy but the amount of dive time. I have managed 120 dives this year (from NC to FL) and my wife has not had any major problem with it. I have, however, also learned when not to go diving and go with her..[/QUOTE]

Well said

 

[Xarifa]

what do your partners think?
....so what do you do? ...

My primary dive buddy is my brother-in-law. His wife doesn't dive, and my husband doesn't dive either. They think it's great, because we're out there with someone we have confidence, in, and we trust.

Maeistero doesn't mention either of those things (key factors in my choice of buddies, regardless of their equipment), so it's hard for me to take his 'dive-buddy gender condundrum' too seriously.

 

[mels_2]

[we were in a bar with a large group a friends. a guy brought a girl with him (as a friend only) and she got drunk and dryhumped every guy in the place. she even grabbed my bf's crotch. out of respect for me, he has made it clear she is no longer accepted by us because of her lack of class. i know that he would never touch her but i would never accept her diving with him because she made it clear she cannot be trusted. any other girl, i have no problem with...as long as she keeps her hands to herself.[/QUOTE]

As long as you have faith in your partner why should it matter if you can trust the other women? I totally trust my husband if another women were to grab his crotch he would tell her (not so nicely and very censored) to keep her hands off.....We wouldn't go out with her again only because he would be unconfomertable. I agree with you that women had NO CLASS.....glad you guys dumped her she sounds like trouble.......

Love and trust are a two way street if it's only one way it should be considered a dead end.