Vintage style backpack for double hose?

[Nemrod]

I cannot speak for other versions of the Freedom Plate but mine has 11 inch center holes and bolt on two piece STA. I believe the suggestion from TN is a good one to consider. If you want the tank to be inclined it would be relatively easy perhaps to place a small spacer under the aft STA. The original style Voit Snug Packs were ergonomic in that the incline was built into the plastic molding and thus the term "Snug Pack."

You can see the 11 inch center bolts for the two piece STA. The wing goes between the plate and the STA just like any regular plate.

My wife's custom Dacor with aluminum miniplate I made. It has since been painted black and uses a Zeagle lumbar support on the inside to stabilize the BC to my wife, note two piece STA of FP origin:

I might make myself a titanium and carbon fiber Snug Pack, hmmmmm, for travel.

A plate of this design would work well with a Phoenix AM due to the short top section, something to consider:

N

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Part of what I'm trying to do with the new aluminum version is to simplify it as much as possible. If I have to figure out how to design a rail or similar component it's going to add up in the form of higher cost. One thing I did consider was to somehow offer a wedge shaped hunk of delrin or even lead that would attach somehow to the back of the plate for those people that want that angle and want the bottom of the plate to kick away from the tank. I admit the rail design is optimal, but I want to try diving this new plate without it just to see if it makes that big of a difference. If you look at conventional style plates they have no ergonomic advantage whatsoever; the tank sits totally flat. At least with my design the plate and tank is allowed to drop into the valley between the shoulder blades which automatically moves the bottom of the tank away from the butt. I found with my big long 7.25" diameter steel 120, the stand off bracket on my other freedom plate seemed to pry the bottom of the plate into my lower back. I had to cut off the bracket and shorten it considerably to make it better with the bigger tank. I don't know if not having any bracket will be bad. Having the tank rest snug on your body and cradling the bottom of the tank with your glutes might work OK. I'll let you guys know.

Come to think of it, I've seen rigs where there was no plate, the tank had some straps attached directly it with some stainless bands and you dove with the tank direcly on your back. Now that is minimal!

One of the issues I'm dealing with as far as a wedge or welding on aluminum is I want to minimize any areas that corrosion could start which would eventually cause the plate to fail somewhere. With rails there is an area where the components sandwich together that can trap salt water. With stainless this might not be a big deal but aluminum has to breathe. There's also the issue of dissimilar metals. If I did come up with a lead or delrin block it would have to be attached with stainless bolts and that could be a maintenance problem. I'm better off figuring out a way to leave it as clean as possible.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I was just thinking,
the other option is to offer a Phoenix adaptor rail that could attach to the plate and could be removed if a regular first stage was used.

 

[Nemrod]

You mean like this?

You know, I have tried to thread the travel harness through the slots on a wing that I have with some success. The crotch strap remains outside the wing but the other straps pull through the slots. I might cut an additional slot for the crotch strap. This type harness does absolutely need the crotch strap. Then I got the idea that I was upside down on my thinking and simply threaded the cambands through the wing slots and voila, it works just fine and dandy. Don't need no stink'n plate but then again, don't need no stink'n BC either. All you really need is a tank and a big knife and some goggles.

Let me say this again, I have dove the Oxy Mach V 18 with the yellow travel harness and yes, it works. In this case, it is possible that a more conventional wing with a wider center web would crowd the harness strap less---something for you guys to consider--ol' Nemrod is out ahead of the pack, you don't need a plate!

And, while on the subject, the idea above came from the Oxy Ultra Light plate, it works just fine, with or without a wing with the PRAM.

N, zen minimalist diver, I am into zen

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

You mean like this?

You know, I have tried to thread the travel harness through the slots on a wing that I have with some success. The crotch strap remains outside the wing but the other straps pull through the slots. I might cut an additional slot for the crotch strap. This type harness does absolutely need the crotch strap.

N

Yeah like that!

I'm working on a set of independant brackets for this purpose.

 

[Nemrod]

What I love about it is that Allan is so anti wing (lol, wink, wink) and so I just felt I had to put the wing on his yellow travel harness just because the juxtaposition of conflicting elements in harmony is pure art, pure zen.

Sometimes when all three neurons are operating I am pretty smart, however, I colored the yellow lettering on my Mach V black with a marker pen and darn it if I had not done that the lettering would have matched the yellow travel harness as if Allan had made it on purpose to match, dang it.

N, I am into zen

 

[Luis H]

I like the idea of the aluminum plate. I don't like the heavy stainless plates. As you mentioned it gives a lot more flexibility for traveling and diving in warm water. I also feel that since I am the one wearing the buoyant neoprene, I need to wear the lead, not my rig. I like both me and my rig to be close to independently neutral.

You are in the right track with avoiding corrosion with an aluminum plate. IMO, using a Delring wedge (or any spacer, even the bottom half of a two piece stainless steel STA), would work best if it is captured by the tank band. This will allow a good fresh water rinse when the tank is removed.

As you mentioned, any stainless steel fasteners that are attached to the aluminum plate should be isolated with some barrier or better yet, a rubber gasket to try and keep salt water out of the joint. It still would have to be taken apart and cleaned fairly often, since there is no way of making a perfect seal.

I like the shape of your plate; it looks similar to the 70's plastic back packs that I normally use.

The only improvement I can think of is adding holes to the sides just inside the strap attachment to work as handles. I personally use those handles (in my plastic backpacks) to don my rig over my head. I also use the side handles just to carry the rig

IMO, the idea of having an optional spaced for the Phoenix is a reasonable compromise if needed. It would probably only be needed for the smaller diameter steel 72's.

BTW, the simple harness is what we call a Sea Hunt style harness and they are being reproduced by Allan. They don't control that single tank as well as a back pack, but over all they work well. He also makes a travel harness with just two high cam action tank bands (similar to the Scubapro tank bands), that works very well. Talking about traveling light, you can pack it in a Ziplock bag.
Harness/Bands : Vintage Double Hose!, Your online source for all things related to vintage diving

 

[Nemrod]

When you put the travel harness through the slots in the wing it gives the rig "body" and stability that neither had alone.

The original stainless Freedom Plates due to their cut down size weigh about what a standard aluminum full plate weighs. They just are not all that heavy and feel so good in the water.

Let me add this, something I have not tried yet but am contemplating, taking a Dive Rite single piece stainless STA and using it as a "spine" for the travel harness when used with a slotted wing. I am wanting to run the cambands around the outside of the STA and then through the STA slots so that the STA sandwiches the wing. it may require a custom made STA to make it work like I want, it is an experiment for post SD.

N, I am "N" to zen

 

[Luis H]

What I love about it is that Allan is so anti wing (lol, wink, wink) and so I just felt I had to put the wing on his yellow travel harness just because the juxtaposition of conflicting elements in harmony is pure art, pure zen.

Sometimes when all three neurons are operating I am pretty smart, however, I colored the yellow lettering on my Mach V black with a marker pen and darn it if I had not done that the lettering would have matched the yellow travel harness as if Allan had made it on purpose to match, dang it.

N, I am into zen

That is funny. I have some pictures at home with one of Allan travel harness and yellow straps, using my Zeagle wind attached to the tank straps. I didn't like how it felt. I decided that if I am going to use just a harness it is for a pure vintage dive...no wing. It would work,but I like a backpack for most of my diving.

On the other hand, IMO the basic harness is the best for double tanks.

Allan is actually playing with a variation of his harness and a different type BC... just for fun, I think he is only doing it for his own amusement.

 

[Luis H]

When you put the travel harness through the slots in the wing it gives the rig "body" and stability that neither had alone.

The original stainless Freedom Plates due to their cut down size weigh about what a standard aluminum full plate weighs. They just are not all that heavy and feel so good in the water.

Let me add this, something I have not tried yet but am contemplating, taking a Dive Rite single piece stainless STA and using it as a "spine" for the travel harness when used with a slotted wing. I am wanting to run the cambands around the outside of the STA and then through the STA slots so that the STA sandwiches the wing. it may require a custom made STA to make it work like I want, it is an experiment for post SD.

N, I am "N" to zen

Oops, I don't type that fast.

I was hoping the wing would add stability to the harness, but the Zeagle is open in the middle, which works great with the doubles and a harness, but didn't do anything for the single tank harness.