Ssi Vs Padi And Others

[Thalassamania]

I love the PADI vs SSI vs "some other agency" posts. It seems its the same conversation as the "LDS vs online sales" posts.

One of my buddies did his OW cert through SSI and I did mine through PADI, I dont think selecting one over the other makes you a better diver over the other. I read through his course material and it was so similar to the PADI OW material that they are almost interchangeable.

You're comparing the two most rigid systems, so that's expected, except I think you get more water work with SSI.

 

[garyfotodiver]

As I recall, more theories and tasks are required than simply diving to 72 ft. We discussed the risk of the dive, the function of the safety stop, the need for slow ascent, and performed cognitive testing at depth with a buddy. This reinforced the understanding of nitrogen narcosis. If you did that with your daughter before the dive, and force her to take a test of knowledge, then, certainly, she attained the understanding to do that dive in the future.

I didn't; the instructors did. That's why I paid them.

You are all missing the point of my last post. Which agency is "better" and which instructor is better are both very subjective things. Each person who takes up diving must make some hard decisions for him(her)self. Advice is welcome and often good, but the final decision rests with the individual.

As is evident from my signature, I am an SSI diver. My daughter went through the PADI course. Why? I knew the instructors who would take her on her checkout dives. They would judge whether she is capable of diving in open water. That is important; the rest is B*** S***. As for the classroom and poolwork, we watched the video together and each answered the handbook questions separately, then compared answers. She passed her tests and got a referral sheet.

When she changed her card, she had the oppurtunity to switch agencies. She didn't because the agency doesn't matter. The instructor and the instruction does. Passion for diving matters; understanding the risks involved and preparing for them matters. The agency name on the card doesn't matter.

 

[jviehe]

Since has turned into yet another bash PADI thread, I guess Ill move on. If anyone has any questions, Im happy to offer answers, but I find PADI debates about as pointless as DIR or Iraq. If you dont like PADI, dont choose them. I think Ive answered the OP.

 

[Thalassamania]

Since has turned into yet another bash PADI thread, I guess Ill move on. If anyone has any questions, Im happy to offer answers, but I find PADI debates about as pointless as DIR or Iraq. If you dont like PADI, dont choose them. I think Ive answered the OP.

When you can't come up with a cogent argument the best thing to do is complain about the oposition, "declare victory" and bug out, no?

 

[95yj]

Sorry, but that's simply not the case. There are big differences from one program to another. Those who honestly believe that haven't looked at different standards very closely.

I didn't say there weren't differences between the differents orgs. I have been certified by PADI, SSI, NAUI and NASDS and know that there are differences. My statement is that all are designed to get you in the water and from that point you need to continue your learning. This is true whether you take the best OW course out there or a 1 day resort quickie. OW, no matter who it is through is just a starting point. Since you should continue your "education" then it doesn't matter who you get started through.

AOW is almost worthless as a learning experience. The only reasons most people take it is because some agencies use it as a prerequisite to take rescue and some charters requite it before they allow folks to dive to 100 feet. Why would anyone want to require 3 courses to dive when one will do? There are still some excellent OW courses available.

While someone with a hundred dives or more might think AOW is worthless, for a newbie, this is a good next step. You'll learn some things here that you haven't had a chance to learn in OW nor in experience yet. If you already have a lot of dives under your belt, Advanced will probably be a waste of money except that you need it to get the next training and Rescue is essential in my book. In Rescue you learn how to help others, but much, much more important, you learn how to help yourself and we all know there are way too many dependent buddies out there.

Also, to make a comment about how much more important the instructor is than the certifying organization, I sent my (now ex) wife through NAUI because I knew they had a good curriculum. The instructor was well known in the field, but after the fact we figured out that he must have burnt himself out. When she finished with the four week course, she knew less than if she would have done a three day class at a resort. I went along on her last checkout dive that was at 40 fathom grotto. She knew nothing about neutral buoyancy, was over weighted and I had to chase her down and stop her decent at about 70 feet all this while the instructor was paying attention to the other students. She received her cert, but didn't ever want to dive again. I ran her through an AOW course right away after interviewing a bunch of instructors and after the couple classes and a weekend of checkout dives, she was enthusiastic about diving again.

 

[fisherdvm]

.......I sent my (now ex) wife through NAUI because I knew they had a good curriculum......

and you should have added, on hind sight, I should have signed her up for PADI (or fill in the blank), and took her on that 250 ft wreck dive with a half empty tank.....



p.s. make sure she doesn't have a dive computer, otherwise you'd leave behind evidence!

 

[MikeFerrara]

I cant speak for how individual PADI instructors teach their classes, or how dive centers advertise or run their classes. The intent of the AOW certification is to recognize basic divers who have ventured into more advanced types of diving. The "course" is not even called Advanced Open Water again. It is called Adventures in Diving, which can result in several different certifications or none. Part of it is to serve as an intro to specialities.

One of those cards says "Advanced Open Water Diver" on it regardless of what the course is named.

Now again, if a dive operator assume that someone who has an AOW card is qualified to dive a wreck at 100ft, that is nieve, as an AOW diver can have never even been on a boat. That is not PADIs responsibility. The scope of the course is publicly available and taught to the students.

Access to certain dives is widely granted on the basis of AOW certification. Many of the resorts, charters and shops that grant access on that basis are PADI retail association members and following PADI standards. Why isn't it PADI's responsibility?

 

[Thalassamania]

One of those cards says "Advanced Open Water Diver" on it regardless of what the course is named. ...

PADI's approach to naming courses has been consistent though it's history. Always use the same name (or a similar one) for a course that is typically one rank down when compared with the standards of other agencies, thus the PADI course requires less time and money. We all know that it’s a lie, PADI Instructors are always apologizing for it and feeling vaguely defensive and inadequate, and the general public not knowing any better, has bought it. That’s how we got to the PADI Advanced Diver and the PADI Master Diver and a PADI entry level course with all but the most bare bones items stripped out of it.

 

[Walter]

My statement is that all are designed to get you in the water and from that point you need to continue your learning. This is true whether you take the best OW course out there or a 1 day resort quickie. OW, no matter who it is through is just a starting point. Since you should continue your "education" then it doesn't matter who you get started through.

So if I design a course that gets you an OW card in 30 minutes with no time in the water, it's just as good as a course with 20 hours of classroom, 20 hours of pool work and 6 open water dives because it's just a starting point?

 

[MikeFerrara]

So if I design a course that gets you an OW card in 30 minutes with no time in the water, it's just as good as a course with 20 hours of classroom, 20 hours of pool work and 6 open water dives because it's just a starting point?

I think you've got their logic right.