Scubapro 109 regulator bad signs and servicing pointers

[halocline]

I thought this thread started with the OP saying he had recently acquired a 109 second? So, assuming that's the case, when you get it, just have the tech put in the current G250 annual kit and spring; it's an easy upgrade and then you're just replacing current rebuild parts when you service it. You can use the current G250 diaphragm if there's a problem with the one on the reg, a mouthpiece is easy to find, leaving only the exhaust tee as the potential problem. You can find those around occasionally, but expect to pay something for it. Even if you have to do that, it will still be a top performing reg at a very low price. Consider that SP is charging (a guess) at least $250 for the G250V, which is the current reg most similar in performance to the old metal case regs. If you spent $50 on the reg, another $50 for parts, and $50 for the rebuild, you're still at least $100 under that.

I wouldn't worry about the brass orifice too much. It probably has one, but if not, you won't miss it much. To those of us that like to play around with these regs, it's a little depressing see a plastic part at the heart of the working part of the reg, but in a blind side by side comparison, I assume I would not be able to tell the difference in breathability. I suspect that the big difference is in how long the reg holds a tune. The brass orifice has a nice sharp edge that takes an accurate groove in the soft seat, while the plastic one probably is going to be less stable over time and require a little more pressure to seal effectively.

 

[Couv]

...G250 annual kit and spring.....

+ lever and balance chamber.

...
..... the G250V, which is the current reg most similar in performance to the old metal case regs.....

But no where near as attractive; as Awap said, can not drive nails with it either. The G250 in addition to being ugly plastic also has that stupid VIVA vane, a removable air barrel requiring more o-rings....some have plastic adjustment knobs....just not something you want to be seen with outside of a cave...

c

 

[Packhorse]

I have some older G250 service kits. These have the S wing poppet and balance chamber plus an asortment of O rings.
I understand new service kits do not have the balance chamber or perhaps the poppet.
If anyone is after a balance chamber or poppet let me know ( I have 3 or 4 of each). If anyone has new soft seats im keen on some.

 

[ericpitar]

Hello people,

I've posted photos of the r109 before (first 4 photos) and after the servicing/cleanup.

1) Can you comment on how neglected/maintained the reg looked based on the condition before and after cleanup (particularly the casing)?

2) Is the corrosion in the cleaned-up casing negligible(photo 6)?

thanks.


e

 

[Luis H]

That looks like it was a bit neglected, but I have bought and have been given some in much worst shape. At least most of the chrome in that one looks in fairly decent shape.

If you rinse ASAP after use in salt water it will be fine. Actually it will work fine anyway, most of the area where the chrome looks a bit worn is just cosmetic.

As I mentioned, I have some that the chrome is in much worst shape and they work great…that one doesn’t look that bad.

 

[redacted]

From what I have seen, the corrosion in the "before" case was minimal (the result of a good rinse rather than a thorough soak). The cleaned case looks great. The poppet looks like the current version so you can just replace the LP seat if necessary (or flip it). Handle that orifice with care. I always keep the orifice and piston separate from other parts so there is no chance of a knife edge getting dinged. Old plastic 35mm film cases work well to store/protect them when not installed.

Looks like a great regulator. Based on the lip on the rubber cover and the knurled adjustment knob, it looks like an intermediate production model.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

It has an earlier style purge cover, the chrome plated brass orifice and the the early style solid adjustment knob so it was probably made no later than the mid 70's.

It also has the pale blue diaphram that dissappeared in the early 80's - but that does not mean much as many dealers treated those as annual replacemetn items until the mid 1980's when SP stopped covering it under warranty as an annual replacement item - after that point it if did not need replacement, Sp did not reimburse the dealer for replacing them.

I agree with the above comments that it is in pretty good shape. It looks like some of the chrome is gone but some of it inside is just darkened. As AWAP points out it has the current poppet, so the lever will not need to be replaced so that is the most common color of diaphragm found.

I have yet to find even the most abused R109 that can not be cleaned and serviced and and produce at least a 1.4 cracking effort. with a new diaphragm and orifice most will do around 1.0 and some of the best will be in the .7-.8 range - which is so low it freeflows in the water, so realistically 1.0 is about the minimum practical setting.

 

[Couv]

I concur with the usual suspects. As AWAP said, it was neglected in the sense that it was not soaked and dried properly. If the diaphragm and orifice are ok (run your thumb nail around the sharp edge to feel any nicks) then all it needs is a good cleaning, a few o-rings and a seat. If you want to upgrade it, it will need a new spring, G250 annual service kit, and balanced chamber. If you were to buy a new regulator today you would probably have to replace it before this one.

 

[ericpitar]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I forgot to include the photo of what parts were installed so here's a photo showing them side-by-side still in the plastic packets (poppet, spring, and chamber).

So, if the tech and I understood each other correctly, my 109 should now be a balanced adjustable...

Questions
1)Can anyone (mabye DA), tell if this chamber is the "A" or "B" G250 HP configuration?
2)What is in the "G250 annual service kit"? The tech replaced the seat, spring, poppet, and pad shown in photo 3 in my initial photo posting and replaced them with the parts shown in the photo below. Based on schematics I've seen of the B/A and research on this board, these (in the photo below) should be everything I needed, correct?

 

[halocline]

All the G250 kits I've bought have the poppet and balance chamber shown in your last photo, and a few o-rings. I guess the new ones do not include the poppet and balance chamber, which means they probably only have a small seat and some tiny o-rings for the balance chamber as well as the usual 3 or so o-rings. Yes, your reg is now a balanced/adjustable. I have no idea what the difference is between the A and B configurations, but I'm looking forward to learning.

So how much does this 5 o-ring, 1 seat kit now cost?