OOA Buddy starts to drag you up by your octo - What would you do?

[Soggy]

Quote from the GUE website:
www.gue.com/Equipment/Config/index.html

" The long hose runs straight down the wing, under the light canister (if one is worn, if not it is routed around the knife, or tucked into the belt), back up the left side, and around the neck; the attached second stage is then placed in one's mouth and breathed"

Maaybe I don't understand the Fundamentals, but I sure can read. Now please tell me why you think I'm kidding.

I'll admit, that's a bad description. The long hose goes behind your neck. In no way, shape, or form, is it wrapped around your neck. That would be idiotic. Please learn about how the long hose is used before making fallacious arguments against it.

 

[Diver Dennis]

A diver with a 7' hose has to duck the head a little when donating gas in the first place. It really does not have much of a chance of ripping the donaters mask off. That is unless they are wearing a snorkel... in which case they should not be diving, but snorkeling.

Um, we're talking about someone dragging you by it, so it would be under a lot of tension. I've had my mask pulled off this way practicing procedures when I didn't unwrap it first, so yes it can happen.

 

[Soggy]

Um, we're talking about someone dragging you by it, so it would be under a lot of tension. I've had my mask pulled off this way practicing procedures when I didn't unwrap it first, so yes it can happen.

Yeah, it is possible. I dislodged my mask a little once before I learned to duck more.

 

[Vayu]

Who needs a mask anyway?

 

[Diver Dennis]

My instructor wanted to teach me a little lesson and gave it a good yank, which is what would happen in the scenario we're talking about. I learned to make sure I take it off...

 

[Ice9]

But the reverse of this is that you choose to dive with someone you're unsure of, with the knowledge that you will ditch them if they head to the surface in a manner you don't agree with. So let's say this happens, your buddy freaks, grabs your reg, and decides to head to the surface. You somehow get away from them, and avoid the uncontrolled ascent.

What do you do then?

I would argue that there's a big difference between ditching your buddy and heading to the surface as quickly as possible to insure they don't drown. Even a 30' per minute ascent would be too slow in my opinion. Unfortunately, no where in your aggressive argument describing why you'd let them go, do you describe what you'd do after they shot to the surface. I would hope you'd at least attempt to slow down their ascent before ditching them from the get go.

Regardless of all this, I'm still not sure why you would do the dive in the first place. I personally will not do 100' dives with people I'm A) not willing to ride to the surface with, and B) not confident in their abilities to not only save them self but me if things get out of hand.

~ Jason

I'm not saying that this actually happened. I'm just posing a hypothetical situation in order to get opinions. Personally, I tend to not want to take that express elevator, and my intent was to find out what others thought about the situation.

Right now, if I were actually in that situation, I don't know what I'd do or how I'd handle it. I have to think that although I'd choose not to take the express elevator if possible, I'd at least surface as quickly as I safely could - faster than 30 fpm I'm betting...

As far as what to do at the surface, I think that goes beyond the scope of the original post. I've never taken a rescue class, so I'm not really even remotely qualified to comment. I guess I'd try and calm them down and try to figure out if he was injured. :ne_nau:

 

[Bill51]

Slightly off topic, but many times the people I see have bad OOA experiences are the ones who claim it will never happen to them and they can’t imagine what fool would get themselves into such a problem. Similarly many of the pilots I see land gear up or run out of fuel were the first ones to point out the stupidity of the pilots who had done it before them. If you can’t visualize and accept that some day, somewhere Murphy is going to pay you a visit then you will never be really prepared for him.

 

[darkpup]

J,

I know some of the guys you dive with. While not all of them are of the caliber of some of the divers you listed, I am pretty sure none of them would let you get dragged to the surface by some stranger without putting up a fight.

And that's why A) I choose the divers I dive with, and B) I would follow them to the surface without question fighting to slow them down the entire way.

My biggest concern with all of this is not the fast ascent. It's the panic'd buddy that may drown once they hit the surface without someone to help them. This goes for the tech dives I do to max 170', and for the NDL recreational dives I do. I'm more worried about my buddy drowning once they hit the surface without me, than I am about the DCS hit.

This changes a bit as the depth gets deeper or if you're in a wreck or cave, but that's why we practice so hard on ways to resolve the problem underwater. It's also why I'm so picky about who I dive with, and why I'm willing to sit out a dive if the environment / buddy team doesn't work for me (i.e. the risk is beyond my comfort zone).

I'll dive with anyone to 60', but there are only a few people I would dive to 170' with. Why should this be any different in the 100' + range while still doing recreational dives?

~ Jason

 

[Steve_Dives]

...neoprene panic-rocket to the top...

Great visualization!

While this violates the scenario posed originally, why did the buddy OOA occur? If your buddy isn't checking the SPG, ask for his/her pressure. Ounce of prevention...

Assuming the panic-rocket ascent, and the attempt to calm them didn't work, I'd get them positive on the surface and then submerge myself. Assuming I had the air, 5 minutes at 60 feet and 15-20 minutes at 20 feet for a rapid ascent from 100+ feet. There should be a hang tank at 15-20 feet. Inform the DM you're performing an in-water omitted deco stop procedure before submerging, but only if the boat is close enough I could submerge myself within 5 minutes. Distance from the boat, vis, and other factors might cause me to alter the in-water deco.

 

[richtpe]

I travel by myself often and I get paired up with "insta-budies" a lot. I try and talk to them before the dive to get a feel for their experience level. While I am, admittedly, not very experienced, if I get paired up with someone just OW certified I'll take that into consideration and be much more attentive. But I am going to do the dive I went on the trip to do. Case in point, I was recently in Cayman and got paired up with a couple on a wall dive (max depth 115') who just got their OW certs .

If I was in the scenario of the OP, I would flair my fins and increase drag as much as possible, dump any air in my BC, try to dump the panicked diver's bc, and purge my octo that's in the panicked diver's mouth with the thought (and hope) that a mouthful of air would calm him (her) down. If we were still shooting to the surface at 40' I would break loose (yanking my octo out of panicked diver's mouth), make a quick, yet safe, ascent and try to help at the surface.

Is this not the appropriate action? I ask this seriously. I am working on my DM cert now (primarily to get the knowledge that I get the sense the experienced divers here feel should be - or used to be - taught in OW or AOW). And I'm not planning on working as a DM any time in the future until I get a lot more experience under my belt. But if I was, there's a good chance an inexperienced diver who’s OOA is coming to me first. And then it would be my job to do the right thing.