Not Feeling Well? New Hand signal.

[boulderjohn]

Point being, show me from the OW course where any student can "thumb" a dive. Where is that taught in any OW course? I need documents, not opinions or clips from the internet or magazines.

When you teach a class, you go over what the student has learned through outside reading. You do something similar when you check out a student who has completed eLearning. Signals, including thumbing the dive and indicating that something is wrong, are in the first section of the PADI class. Both signals are on the final exam.

One of the things that is taught is that thumbing the dive is a "command signal." If it is given, it must receive a response. The buddy returns the thumb. The dive is over, and the buddies ascend. This makes two points obvious.

1. An instructor who does not in some way point out that something being wrong is a reason to end the dive is a babbling idiot.
2. A student who does not understand without being told that something being wrong is a good reason to end the dive is equally idiotic.

Are you saying that as an OW student, you would not understand that something being wrong is a reason to end the dive? Are you saying that as an OW student, you would believe you are required to complete the dive as originally planned, no matter what happens to you during that dive?

 

[Jake 10]

for years this hand signal has been a "cool", "hang-out", "neat", "that was awesome (during a dive), "all is good" type of messaged signal

 

[jlcnuke]

Always thought some-thing-wrong was holding a fist with thumb and little finger outstretched and waggling the hand

Why does this need a new hand signal to confuse everyone?

Worse still, your rotating signalling hand could catch on your snorkel and knock your mask off...

The Shaka sign (what you're describing) is used all over the place to mean "things are great" or similar. I've never heard anyone using that as a sign that something is wrong. In fact, I routinely use it to express that something on the dive was particularly great.
I teach the WRSTC gesture for something is wrong (flat hand, tilting back and forth) mentioned earlier in the thread. I'm interested to know where you learned the Shaka was the sign for something wrong, as I've never seen or heard anyone using that to mean that.

 

[DiveProKoko]

Could you show me in any globally certified OW dive course syllabus where ("they can thumb a dive for any reason") this is taught?

I do belive globallly all that is actually taught is to "Not dive, when Not felling well," or something similiar.
thnx

From the SSI OW Training Manual (Section 4) "Each diver has the right at any time, for any reason, to call off a dive, even if you are dressed and ready to enter the water." This includes during the dive. And the handsignal you're looking for is:

 

[OMyMyOHellYes]

Why is one counter clockwise and the other clockwise?

Well, it depends on if you're the one making it or standing/floating in front, facing them.

 

[Johnoly]

When you teach a class,

It's been 25yrs since my BOW
How many total (or approx) hand signals are there across all the agencies?

 

[DiveProKoko]

And again, could you please show me in any OW course, from the OW course sylyyylbus where these hand signals are taught? ............Point being, show me from the OW course where any student can "thumb" a dive. Where is that taught in any OW course? I need documents, not opinions or clips from the internet or magazines.

Screenshot from SSI OW Manual - Section 4 (Digital Learning) - Dive Briefing/Planning

 

[boulderjohn]

It's been 25yrs since my BOW
How many total (or approx) hand signals are there across all the agencies?

The current PADI OW manual I have (I stopped teaching this year) shows 25 signals, not including this new one. I was taught more when I took classes in tech and cave diving. I have a book showing a wide variety, but I am not going to count them all.

It is easy to forget some of them. For example, when I saw a teammate's backup light on a couple years ago, I could not for the life of me remember that one, and I had to grab him and show him his backup light was on. That's a pretty uncommon sign. Basic ones (including something wrong) are hard to forget.

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

I think the proposed "new" signal in the first post is unnecessary and could be potentially confusing....... especially if ever used on group dive with others who may have not thoroughly discussed and agreed on the signal.

The traditional palm down (somethings wrong) waver followed by pointing to the problem area is pretty much universally understood.

The other thing I feel worth mentioning is that there's been a lot of discussion on this thread about "thumbing" dives. I feel it's important to emphasise that there's a big difference between "thumbing" a dive and "ending" a dive.

For us, "thumbing" a dive means that we are immediately safely proceeding either directly to the surface or to any required obligation depth. No ifs, ands or buts.

Ending a dive (for us) is simply crossed forearms followed by index finger pointed up and twirling. This means "dive is ended, RTB". I just thought this was an important distinction.

And for the record, I am definitely in the group who agrees that ANY person can either abort or not even begin a dive ANY time for ANY reason. That is such an obviously accepted rule that anyone who feels that they need to see it in writing isn't playing with a full deck.

 

[scubaozy]

need to invent "I am not very good with feelings" signal.