No wing on a backplate harness and tank for Caribbean shallow diving -how does this work?

[L13]

The recreational wing only "compensates" for air breathed during the dive and wetsuit crush as you go deep, if you are properly weighted. without a wetsuit, crush is zero. With an AL 80, air breathed is less than 6#(usually 4-5#). An average human has a usable lung volume of more than 5 liters, and needs to move less than a liter per breath unless working hard. this leave more than 4 liters of volume that can be used to weight compensate or about 9#. If perfectly weighted, you can start the dive breathing around mostly full lungs, and end the dive breathing around mostly empty lungs. at the beginning of the dive you have at most 6# you have to swim up if you can't adjust your breathing to compensate (say because you are breathing deep because you are working hard). As the dive progresses, this drops to almost 0# by the end. For someone in good shape, this is easy. For the rest of us, we could do it if we perfected our technique.

The other function of the wing is to keep you solidly on the surface without much effort before/after the dive. This is an important safety function!

 

[Bubblesong]

It’s like walking barefoot, it can be done easily in most places but there are places and time where you need shoes.

I think yours is the “breakwater” comment I needed to decide. I have walked that “ouchy” beach and can still feel it. So yes, I can go without wing if all goes well, but no, I really need wing if it all goes to hell.
Thank you everyone!

 

[Nemrod]

So from some earlier posts and photos i see warm water divers with just a air tank on plastic backplate strapped on and no wing or BCD, no wetsuit, no floaty stuff at all. How does this work, just for shallow dives? Do you eventually float up anyway as you drain the tank?

Once upon a time long ago in a galaxy far, far away, this was the norm. There was no BCs. We were taught to weight ourself such that at the start of the dive we would be to the negative and at the end of the dive somewhat positive. Safety stops were not a thing at we made direct to surface ascents at 60 fpm (no deco profiles).

Since rubber suits tend to compress it was generally needed to swim down, then swim around and then swim back up. At shallow depths the suits would decompress and restore some buoyancy. And you always have a very effective BC naturally, your lungs. It was also quite often practiced to borrow a rock from the bottom if your weighting was a bit off .

No BC diving is easy and fun, you just have to limit your exposure protection, at least at first, until you get the concepts down. If you have a heavy tech plate and a negative steel tank, it will not work so well, maybe with a heavy suit and allowing for suit compression but still------. You want to use an aluminum 80 or better yet the 63 or a steel 72 or similar tank that the buoyancy specs drift about neutral average for the course of a dive. And leave off all the octopus and long hoses and STAs and all that unneeded paraphernalia, because that is how we did it and that is how it works. All that fuss and bother we have added to ourselves in pursuit of some magical safety factor will only contribute to making no BC diving more difficult and much less fun. And snorkels become an important accessory kit.

Oh, and in those days, most SCUBA divers were watermen and women, strong swimmers and at home in the water. Have you ever seen a surfer wearing a lifejacket? Yeah, they and like early divers were strong swimmers.

James

 

[justinthedeeps]

So from some earlier posts and photos i see warm water divers with just a air tank on plastic backplate strapped on and no wing or BCD, no wetsuit, no floaty stuff at all. How does this work, just for shallow dives? Do you eventually float up anyway as you drain the tank?

Yeah if you are properly neutral during the dive and not overweighted, then with <750psi/50bar left in the tank you will only be able to take a half-breath when you return to the shallows, without popping up.

If not, you will probably have started the dive overweighted, and likely ended up touching or silting the reef/bottom during the first portion of the dive. That's not cool either.

Some cave/drysuit divers like to delete the wings off their rigs. The advantages are dubious, but I guess it simplifies setup and broadcasts their belief that they are so good that they don't need wings anymore (even though it's always just been there for backup/emergencies anyway).

 

[Vicko]

Most of my recreational dives are like that.
Well actually with a 2x10l doubles with just armbands and a waist strap. I just weigh myself to be a bit negative at 3m on entry and use my lung volume to offset the rest. That's with a 5 or 8mm wetsuit.
Diving with a al80 or something with similar buoyancy characteristics would be a massive pain.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I always said, if you want to teach someone about proper weighting just take away their BC.
After they learn what proper weighting is (they won’t have a choice) they will soon realize that the BC was originally just supposed to be a tool to COMPENSATE for heaviness at DEPTH.
It is not an elevator, it is not a life jacket, it is not a safety raft to keep you floating on the surface as a means to overcome being overweighted.
Too much push button diving going on these days.

 

[Scuba Lawyer]

ah if you are properly neutral during the dive and not overweighted, then with <750psi/50bar left in the tank you will only be able to take a half-breath when you return to the shallows, without popping up.

That's why we were taught to fill our game bags with abalone and lobster during the dive. The weight of the bag at the end of the dive compensated for the added bouyancy as tank air depleted. Kinda not politically correct these days, but it certainly worked.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Kinda not politically correct these days, but it certainly worked.

It is where I dive.

 

[Scuba Lawyer]

It is where I dive.

Me too but I have very sensitive feelings and didn't want to get yelled at for my penchant for spearing halibut and limiting out on lobster as often as possible.

 

[rx7diver]

So from some earlier posts and photos i see warm water divers with just a air tank on plastic backplate strapped on and no wing or BCD, no wetsuit, no floaty stuff at all. How does this work, just for shallow dives? Do you eventually float up anyway as you drain the tank?

A major concern is whether a dive op will allow you to dive without a BC. I purchased a BC (a VDH 23# Argonaut Wing) and added a "safe second" for diving with my double-hose regulator primarily because I suspect that it's likely that a dive op will not allow me to dive without these things when diving my DH.

The irony is that trying out my (used) double-hose regulator without a BC (and without a safe second) shortly after I had just purchased my DH a few years ago was my very first experience diving in open water (well, in my neighborhood shallow quarry) without a BC. Such an epiphany!

ETA: .

rx7diver