NAUI VS PADI (again???? Well not quite...)

[randytay]

Throughout my dive career, the one thing my NAUI instructors (including ITs and CDs) "bragged" about is the academic freedom NAUI offers their instructors. The picture they paint of PADI is that PADI instructors has to follow a very strict progression in terms of how they teach and the order of topics within the courses.

However, knowing some PADI instructors myself (some of the current PADI CDs who are also current or former NAUI CDs), they paint a different picture. They explained that as long as you teach what you need to within the course, it doesn't matter how you present them or the order it is being presented.

Can current PADI CDs weigh in on this?

Also, for those who are familiar (by that definition, I refer to those who are immersed in both the NAUI and PADI culture, not simply belonging to NAUI and hearing about PADI), what exactly does the "Academic Freedom" NAUI touts that PADI is lacking?

 

[tomfcrist]

The difference lies in the certification process. PADI= cover required material, cover instructor add ons(yes PADI instructors do teach beyond the book), test on required material, and if the student can pass an exam and OW(not including the instructors additional content) they get a card.
NAUI= the same as PADI except, s NAUI instructor can refuse to certify a student until all of HIS/Her requirements are mastered as well. Basically any material can be added and made into a prerequisite for certification. A NAUI instructor can also create his own tests. The list goes on, but I think you get the jist of it.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, this doesn't make NAUI "better" than PADI, it makes NAUI unique. And in reality, there are a great deal of excellent instructors out there for either agency, so as long as the final product is competent divers ....who cares?

 

[Quero]

<snip> as long as the final product is competent divers ....who cares?

I think "who cares" are the bean counters. They want market share.

NAUI members mistakenly pin a lot of faith on the "non-profit" label, believing (e.g., having faith) that this somehow makes NAUI more worthy than PADI, SSI or any other for-profit scuba certification agency. But in truth, it matters very little that an organization claims to be "not for profit"; they all want a profit--the only difference is where their profit goes, whether to shareholders (PADI et. al.) or to the "operating" and "reserve" funds of the organization. I served for many years in leadership positions in a medium-sized education-sector non-profit (different field though), including a long tenure as an elected member of the Board of Directors (much as NAUI's governance is organized), and I know this to be a fact.

What happens to monies that are generated through a non-profit's "fundraising" efforts (anything that generates funds, including membership dues) is that staff salaries are paid (including a typically six-figure salary for the Executive Director), office space is leased or purchased, lawyers are retained, periodical and other print materials are developed and produced through the publishing arm, websites are created and maintained (including purchase of all servers and other hardware for HQ), advertising and marketing is undertaken, etc., etc., etc., etc., in accordance with the operating budget projections. Reserve funds are also plumped up according to targets and policies adopted by the Board. (For the non-profit I served as a Board Member for the period of my tenure, this target was three full years of normally budgeted expenditures, assuming no generated income during the period, but I expect it has now gone to five years.)

So that's "who cares." Beyond the concerns of Boards of Directors and considering instead the actual divers who are certified by actual instructors through each agency's curriculum, I agree entirely with Tom's conclusion.

 

[randytay]

Thanks quero, but I'm really not interested in the profit vs non-profit. My question is on the argument of "academic freedom". But Tom has summarized it for me.

 

[Quero]

My question is on the argument of "academic freedom". But Tom has summarized it for me.

Thus opening up the thread to wider discussion, including discussion of Tom's question, "Who cares?"

 

[tye1138]

The reason I went NAUI was instructor freedom.

- I can be independent of any shop, all profits go to me.
- I decide who passes and needs to try again, not the agency.
- I build my own courses which are based around actually diving and learning how to become a better diver, rather then drilling non-stop.
- NAUI is a smaller group of instructors and everyone has a chance to make changes within the curriculum.

I've sat in on SSI, PADI, NAUI and TDI courses before, they're all the same in terms on what you learn. The difference is, how the material is relayed to the student.

PADI dumbs it down to the most common denominator and honestly, it infuriates me to read or watch any of their materials. SSI and NAUI, are behind the times slightly on their course material (older gear in the pix and video, etc) but the data written is more in depth in my view. TDI of course has the best documentation of them all, I really like their courses.

In the end, it all comes down to the instructor. I believe, someone who is teaching on their own, collecting all the profits, is going to do a better job, then someone who is making almost no money and dealing with huge class loads. To me teaching SCUBA diving is about making good divers one person after the next, its not about profits. Anyone can make their own courses (based on the basic material) and make great divers out of anyone who is willing. The problem is, most people don't do it and it seems to me, the reason they don't is possibly because of the agency's restrictions.

 

[randytay]

Thus opening up the thread to wider discussion, including discussion of Tom's question, "Who cares?"

Don't think that was a question, more like a statement. However, straying from that to "profit vs non-profit" is grossly off-topic IMHO. Nevertheless, thank you for your input.

---------- Post added November 27th, 2012 at 01:08 AM ----------

Thank you the for your perspective. That was one of the reason I went with NAUI, but I didn't see where was the academic freedom "advantage" until Tom summarizes it and you nailing the point that "you" decide who passes or needs to try again vs the agency.

 

[Thalassamania]

One of the points being missed is that NAUI is often the agency of convenience. Underwater scientists trained to AAUS standards usually get a NAUI cert ... cause the standards fit. Military divers, including Special Forces, usually get a NAUI cert ... cause the standards fit. You see, as long as the minimum requirements of NAUI are met you can issue a NAUI card, and many organizations that are outside of the recreational community use NAUI as a convenience. PADI programs could not be used, primarily because of the order of things.

 

[DBailey]

The one part that I don't like about NAUI is the unknown consistency of the instruction due to the potential unknown, not quality controlled, added content by the instructor. Two divers that had two different instructors could have taken completely different courses, but both are issued the same certification. It can even happen with the same instructor. He/she could certify two different divers with completely different courses. I understand that all of the basic scuba skills are covered in each instance.

Back to the OP...

Within PADI, yes the modules of the class have to be completed in order; however, the skills within the module can be completed in any order. Also, certain open water dives/skills cannot be completed until certain modules of the classroom and/or confined water are completed. The module order is important because the student can use multiple instructors/locations to complete his/her dive training. Each instructor signs off the completed module; therefore, the next instructor doesn't have to guess where to pick up and that instructor knows exactly which skills have been completed.

For the most part, doing the skills in order of the modules makes sense. Partial mask flood comes before mask remove, replace, and clear; therefore, it makes sense. More complex or involved skills come later once the student has spent time in the gear and water and has completed some of the basic skills; therefore, those make sense. There are only a couple of skills that really don't make too much sense on "why do I have to do it here, instead of there" aspect.

I know many people out there complain that PADI has this rigid order in which you have to complete the skills, but I would be willing to bet that most non-PADI courses follow pretty closely to the general skill order because it makes sense.

 

[g1138]

NAUI Instructors don't have to use NAUI books. They can use a book from the 70's and as long as their students meet the minimum standards in skills and knowledge they can get certified. The academic freedom IMO is the ability to use all your own teaching materials if you wanted to.

I know of an instructor who loans books or has his students check them out at the library because he genuinely teaches as a hobby and looks to save his diver's money. He uses a very old non-scuba agency book too and fills in the gaps with a whiteboard and pen. His students come out just as competent as any other.