OP
PADI Rescue Diver vs SSI Stress and Rescue
- Thread starter Pulmcc
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
OP
Pulmcc
Registered
Thank you and DiveLikeAMuppet for your suggestions. All our dives have been guided so there has always been a professional nearby if needed but fortunately, we have never needed any assistance. Honestly, I will never dive without a guide because I want to always have that safety net so the reason for wanting to do the rescue course was to take more ownership and responsibility for ourselves rather than depending on someone else. If we don't do this now, we could do as many as 9 fun dives and 4 deep dives (to complete our SSI course) while we are in Cozumel in May. Not sure if there are that many good places to dive in Cozumel though.
We will be in Maldives in July so should be able to get 10-15 more fun (supervised) dives there as well.
There is a difference between diving with a guide ( as part of a group) and diving under the direct supervision of an instructor ( as on a course).Thank you and DiveLikeAMuppet for your suggestions. All our dives have been guided so there has always been a professional nearby if needed but fortunately, we have never needed any assistance. Honestly, I will never dive without a guide because I want to always have that safety net so the reason for wanting to do the rescue course was to take more ownership and responsibility for ourselves rather than depending on someone else. If we don't do this now, we could do as many as 9 fun dives and 4 deep dives (to complete our SSI course) while we are in Cozumel in May. Not sure if there are that many good places to dive in Cozumel though.
A guide is just that, a guide, not responsible directly for you. An instructor has a direct responsibility for your safety so inevitably there is an element of babysitting.
DiveLikeAMuppet
Contributor
Thank you and DiveLikeAMuppet for your suggestions. All our dives have been guided so there has always been a professional nearby if needed but fortunately, we have never needed any assistance. Honestly, I will never dive without a guide because I want to always have that safety net so the reason for wanting to do the rescue course was to take more ownership and responsibility for ourselves rather than depending on someone else. If we don't do this now, we could do as many as 9 fun dives and 4 deep dives (to complete our SSI course) while we are in Cozumel in May. Not sure if there are that many good places to dive in Cozumel though.
I simply meant just some extra dives, guided or not, that are not training dives.
About dive guides. There is a quote by Tom Mount: "Only you can breathe for you, only you can swim for you, only you can think for you”. Dive guides are there to provide local knowledge about the dive site, to trained autonomous divers. You might get separated, the dive guide might need to help another diver or even simply need help themselves - so I probably wouldn't rely on a dive guide for safety.
- Messages
- 16,531
- Reaction score
- 5,316
- # of dives
- 1000 - 2499
OP
Pulmcc
Registered
Got it. I also don't want to rely on a guide for safety, hence the reason for considering the rescue dive course. Looking back, we have done 12 purely guided dives. We did 10 open water dives to get our initial OW certification but I don't remember if any of the last couple would be considered guided vs supervised dives. Nevertheless, I appreciate your suggestion to get more fun dives before proceeding with a rescue course. Thanks again.
I think Rescue is one of the best courses a diver can take and I don't think you need to wait past what you've already done. The level of self-awareness it teaches, as well as awareness of others, really elevates divers IMO. PADI vs. SSI will make almost no difference for you, I got signed off for both at once so (at least 10 years ago) they were almost identical.
- Messages
- 20,628
- Reaction score
- 20,158
- Location
- Philadelphia and Boynton Beach
- # of dives
- 1000 - 2499
It really depends on the instructor.
The main thing to consider is that a recreational rescue class should spend at least as much, if not more, time on PREVENTING accidents.
A recreational rescue class will also NOT prepare you to do much in water unless you practice the skills regularly. There are thousands of "Rescue Divers" who haven't practiced one single thing since the class. But they puff their chest out and say "I'm a Rescue Diver" in an effort to impress those who don't know any better. I've met a few of them. I wouldn't get in a wading pool with them.
Some of the in-water stuff you will do in the class is not very realistic in an actual emergency.
The missing diver scenario - recreational rescue divers will only be used in the water as a last resort and more than likely as snorkelers on the surface. If that.
You will not be prepared to do a proper search, and frankly, many professionals (DMs and Instructors) are not qualified to do it.
Actual Public Safety Divers will be called in, because the truth is, more often than not, a missing diver is going to be found on the surface or RECOVERED on the bottom. It's not a rescue scenario, it's a body recovery.
Rescue Tow- Trying to give rescue breaths to a stricken diver on the surface in the water, has maybe .01% chance of even delivering an effective breath by a recreational rescue diver. Once the adrenalin kicks in and you have people possibly shouting, screaming, and crying what will happen is:
1. You'll cut the airway off trying to get high enough to get a breath in,
2. Turn the head so airway is cut off,
3. Push the victims head underwater allowing more water into their mouth/nose,
4. Ensure brain damage/death because you delayed getting them to a hard surface where compressions can be done, O2 applied, and an AED used.
In reality, the best thing is to get them to a hard surface, boat, or shore as fast as possible rather than jerking around trying to give them breaths. Unless you have practiced this enough to 100% guarantee you can be effective. Slightest doubt? Don't waste the time.
Tired Diver Tow? Not a problem. But be prepared in case they go into full blown panic. If that happens you make sure their weights are gone and BC inflated. Then push them off and wait until they tire themselves out and resume the tow.
I always taught my students that Rescue should be the FIRST class you take after open water. Any open-water diver can be trained to recognize stress, problems with equipment, poor dive planning and preparation, and see that conditions are not suitable. The YMCA and later SEI required an OW cert and 10 dives to take the SLAM/DRAM (SEI) Rescue class which was one of the first recreational Rescue classes.
Why? Because of the things I just said. There is no need to make divers wait to make them safer.
UW Nav is a great class! I wrote my own that exceeds the standards of any organization. But UW Nav practice is NOT necessary for a recreational rescue diver. It is for PSD Divers who would be doing the actual navigating underwater. The recreational guy will be on the surface looking for bubbles.
Agency doesn't matter. Find an instructor that focuses on preventing accidents.
The main thing to consider is that a recreational rescue class should spend at least as much, if not more, time on PREVENTING accidents.
A recreational rescue class will also NOT prepare you to do much in water unless you practice the skills regularly. There are thousands of "Rescue Divers" who haven't practiced one single thing since the class. But they puff their chest out and say "I'm a Rescue Diver" in an effort to impress those who don't know any better. I've met a few of them. I wouldn't get in a wading pool with them.
Some of the in-water stuff you will do in the class is not very realistic in an actual emergency.
The missing diver scenario - recreational rescue divers will only be used in the water as a last resort and more than likely as snorkelers on the surface. If that.
You will not be prepared to do a proper search, and frankly, many professionals (DMs and Instructors) are not qualified to do it.
Actual Public Safety Divers will be called in, because the truth is, more often than not, a missing diver is going to be found on the surface or RECOVERED on the bottom. It's not a rescue scenario, it's a body recovery.
Rescue Tow- Trying to give rescue breaths to a stricken diver on the surface in the water, has maybe .01% chance of even delivering an effective breath by a recreational rescue diver. Once the adrenalin kicks in and you have people possibly shouting, screaming, and crying what will happen is:
1. You'll cut the airway off trying to get high enough to get a breath in,
2. Turn the head so airway is cut off,
3. Push the victims head underwater allowing more water into their mouth/nose,
4. Ensure brain damage/death because you delayed getting them to a hard surface where compressions can be done, O2 applied, and an AED used.
In reality, the best thing is to get them to a hard surface, boat, or shore as fast as possible rather than jerking around trying to give them breaths. Unless you have practiced this enough to 100% guarantee you can be effective. Slightest doubt? Don't waste the time.
Tired Diver Tow? Not a problem. But be prepared in case they go into full blown panic. If that happens you make sure their weights are gone and BC inflated. Then push them off and wait until they tire themselves out and resume the tow.
I always taught my students that Rescue should be the FIRST class you take after open water. Any open-water diver can be trained to recognize stress, problems with equipment, poor dive planning and preparation, and see that conditions are not suitable. The YMCA and later SEI required an OW cert and 10 dives to take the SLAM/DRAM (SEI) Rescue class which was one of the first recreational Rescue classes.
Why? Because of the things I just said. There is no need to make divers wait to make them safer.
UW Nav is a great class! I wrote my own that exceeds the standards of any organization. But UW Nav practice is NOT necessary for a recreational rescue diver. It is for PSD Divers who would be doing the actual navigating underwater. The recreational guy will be on the surface looking for bubbles.
Agency doesn't matter. Find an instructor that focuses on preventing accidents.
Similar threads
