How would you handle this?

[Diver0001]

Don't know. But possible, yes.

Doubt that this could happen in the states unless there were possible legal issues involved, like endangered species living on the breakwater.

In Holland we have a ban on any kind of fishing using scuba gear. The entire bottom of the ocean here is *covered* in lobsters, to the point where fishermen themselves have been lobbying government to allow divers to harvest them because lobsters eat *everything* and it is putting populations of other animals under pressure.

And even with the huge numbers of lobsters and support from the traditional foes of divers on this issue, if you're caught with a lobster in your car then the authorities will take away *all* of your diving gear... no fine, no slap on the wrist, no warning, you just lose all of your diving gear.

Needless to say, few divers dare to harvest even one lobster, which goes to show that if the sanction is heavy enough, people will conform.

Lobbying to get the site closed shouldn't be too hard. It's a well known site in the PNW and there is unlikely to be any public resistance to having it closed for hunting. Given that it's election time, it might even be possible to get a politician to do it for a small price of some free public exposure, a radio interview or small article in the newspaper and a few well timed tweets.

R..

 

[rhwestfall]

until the "extremest" joins the cause. Then it becomes: "any diver in the water is causing undue stress on this treasured resource"..... Knee jerk - no diving in this sanctuary, or no diving during the time they raise young.... Whoops!

Been there, seen that, got the T-shirt. We now have police "sharp shooters" enter areas to control game that has grown beyond its normal environment.....

 

[danvolker]

until the "extremest" joins the cause. Then it becomes: "any diver in the water is causing undue stress on this treasured resource"..... Knee jerk - no diving in this sanctuary, or no diving during the time they raise young.... Whoops!

Been there, seen that, got the T-shirt. We now have police "sharp shooters" enter areas to control game that has grown beyond its normal environment.....

As Jim Abernethy recently proved inn the Bahamas with Sharks....that each shark is worth close to a quarter of a million each year........ In a tourism economy, in the area where this octopus was taken, it should be clear to the county and state that their revenue is overwhelmingly going to benefit from making the area a no-take zone. Revenue for government will trump the PEOPLE OUT OF THE WILD group pretty easily on this.
It does not matter that they do it for the wrong reason...the divers working this no-take mandate, with the government people, would be doing it for the right reason.

 

[lowviz]

I think it is clear that we can NOT trust these types of people. They have demonstrated that they have no respect for the ocean and the fragile ecology. ...//..,

For me it is vegetarians. Plants kill nothing to live, they generate endless valuable substances, de novo, from inorganic matter. This makes plants a highly superior life form, in my view. Vegetarians eat plants. Something must be done!

I can subsist happily on plant parasites. You know, cows, fish, stuff like that...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

We are not lobbying to close the site ... or make it off-limits to fishing in general. There's an active fishing pier nearby, and lots of the regulars on that pier are people I consider friends ... when I find fishing lures, I'll often go over there and give them away. I respect other people's right to hunt and fish ... and I want them to respect the rights of those who use the water for other recreational purposes.

Octopus are not fish ... they tend to den in a place, and you can often find the same one in that same place for months at a time. They're particularly vulnerable to hunters when they're denning for just that reason ... at dive sites where dens are known locations, it's a simple matter to swim down, "coax" the animal out of the den and wrestle it to the surface. If it was socially acceptable for hunters to take octos from local dive sites, within a few days there would be none left for anyone to see. This would have a pretty serious financial impact on the local dive businesses because these are the primary creatures that people come here to see. This is why it isn't done.

At any rate, it'll soon be a moot point, because there appears to be strong support among the state and municipal agencies who've been contacted to help us designate this as a no-take zone for octopus. All the local dive businesses are on board, as well as the Washington Scuba Alliance. So it's now just a matter of follow-through. It won't cost the state anything, and local businesses can make a good case for why it's a boon to the economy to protect these animals at this and other popular dive sites. So it's a no-brainer. What amazes me is that it takes something like this to make it happen.

... and there's still more than 200 miles of accessible coastline just in the greater Pugetropolis area where hunters can go and hunt these creatures ... they don't need to be taking them out of what amounts to "parks" ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[spectrum]

Congratulations Bob for giving this a voice and I assume being part of getting the government to take action.

I love a happy ending.

Pete

 

[lowviz]

...//... What amazes me is that it takes something like this to make it happen. ...//...

What amazes me is that the grinning dumbass couldn't drive another fifteen minutes and get his jollies killing octos in private.

 

[Zen Diving Inc.]

As Jim Abernethy recently proved inn the Bahamas with Sharks....that each shark is worth close to a quarter of a million each year........ In a tourism economy, in the area where this octopus was taken, it should be clear to the county and state that their revenue is overwhelmingly going to benefit from making the area a no-take zone. Revenue for government will trump the PEOPLE OUT OF THE WILD group pretty easily on this.
It does not matter that they do it for the wrong reason...the divers working this no-take mandate, with the government people, would be doing it for the right reason.

Dan, I take it you haven't spent much time in Washington state. People don't flock to PNW to go diving as they do the Bahamas. The diving portion of "Tourism" revenue is negligible. You couldn't even say that theres is significant source of revenue (tax) from diving in that state as a whole. Last time I heard, it was around a 10 million dollar a year industry there. The average baseball player is worth more to the state (game revenue/ no income tax) then all the dive shops put together. I can tell you from my experience there are far more spear fisher men in that state diving on a regular basis then tourist coming to take pictures of the GPO. I agree the ocean could use more sanctuaries, however you wont see any changes in fish populations until regulations off shore become more strict and better practices are put into place. That or we stop eating seafood. 1 diver, 100 divers are nothing compared to the average commercial fishing boat. I don't understand why everyone is crying over this.... Next thing you know, they will be complaining about divers harvesting Dungeness crab, Lingcod, Geoducks and Surf perch... I eat octopus all the time at the sushi joints, taste good to me. If you eat from the waters, don't complain about those who take from it. I don't have any respect for this guy or how he hunts, but y'all are acting like a lynch mob. Here's my "what would jesus do" t-shirt saying for you. "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone". Its starting to sound like a PETA infomercial in here. Hey crabs have feelings too, i'm sure its mostly pain while I boil them alive. What about the lobster hunters? You know its common practice to twist the tail off the body of the lobster then shove the antenna up its poop tube to clean it. Does that bother you too?

---------- Post Merged at 08:50 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 08:26 PM ----------

... and there's still more than 200 miles of accessible coastline just in the greater Pugetropolis area where hunters can go and hunt these creatures ... they don't need to be taking them out of what amounts to "parks" ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

So the guy that wants to go spearfishing doesn't get the same amenities as the regular divers or people fishing off the dock. No they have to go somewhere with no bathrooms or freshwater to rinse off with. Im from washington, 99% of all the shore dives i've done there were started from a park or private access. So please do tell where all the spear fishermen should go as to not offend anyone. I 'd love a list of all those great dives sites that are easy to get to with fresh water, bathroom, close parking and short walk to the beach. Not that I need it, its just the point. So what now they are second rate divers because they hunt. They need to stay out of sight now. The state built those parks for everyone not just you Bob. I don't know whats worse, this idiot who obviously has no class or you trying to impose your ideals on people to the point were spear fishermen are being excluded from what was made for everyone to enjoy. No, they cant hunt at any of Bobs dives sites. God forbid they kill any of his pets.

 

[spoolin01]

Well said, each of your posts ZD. I do think you were too critical of the intervention. If not someone like NWGD, then who? More police? He was involved first hand and made it personal. I think we'd be better off with more of that. Nothing wrong with toe to toe over conscience The mob thuggery is something else all together.

 

[danvolker]

Dan, I take it you haven't spent much time in Washington state. People don't flock to PNW to go diving as they do the Bahamas. The diving portion of "Tourism" revenue is negligible. You couldn't even say that theres is significant source revenue (tax) from diving in that state as a whole. Last time I heard, it was around a 10 million dollar a year industry there. The average baseball player is worth more to the state (game revenue/ no income tax) then all the dive shops put together. I can tell you from my experience there are far more spear fisher men in that state diving on a regular basis then tourist coming to take pictures of the GPO. I agree the ocean could use more sanctuaries, however you wont see any changes in fish populations until regulations off shore become more strict and better practices are put into place. That or we stop eating seafood. 1 diver, 100 divers are nothing compared to the average commercial fishing boat. I don't understand why everyone is crying over this.... Next thing you know, they will be complaining about divers harvesting Dungeness crab, Lingcod, Geoducks and Surf perch... I eat octopus all the time at the sushi joints, taste good to me. If you eat from the waters, don't complain about those who take from it. I don't have any respect for this guy or how he hunts, but y'all are acting like a lynch mob. Here's my "what would jesus do" t-shirt saying for you. "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone". Its starting to sound like a PETA infomercial in here. Hey crabs have feelings too, i'm sure its mostly pain while I boil them alive. What about the lobster hunters? You know its common practice to twist the tail off the body of the lobster then shove the antenna up its poop tube to clean it. Does that bother you too?

Michael,
As most here know, I spearfished myself for 3 decades, and will still spear in the future. But even guys I used to spear with like Frank Hammett or Pat Frain, would not think of shooting fish or octopus in a petting zoo ( or BHB marine park. ) To Frank, or Pat, or to me, this would be only for the scum.
I totally support spearfishing for your own meals, in areas of sustainable harvest, off shore. I don't support spearfishing around the swimmers at the public beach or near it.... I don't think all spearfisherman are Good and worthy of my support, any more than are PEOPLE in general. There are good people and bad people, there are those capable of identifying obvious right, from obvious wrong. Those who choose to act against this need to be seen as they are. We need to discriminate which is which, and act accordingly. If you think the wrong is trivial, then you may see it as a wrong, but not one worth risking your life or your welfare over. If you think the wrong committed must be answered, then you act. Many divers will act over an issue like this.

As to tourism in the PNW, granted I know little of the economic impact of diving in this area where the octopus was harvested/killed. Still, from what I gather, more divers would be willing to pay money to prevent harvested octopus, than would be collected by the state or municipality for the fishing license and any thing paid for each killed octopus. Divers "paying" against the killing, would include hotel room/nights, restaurant expenditures, diving expenses, and the total economic impact. On the flip side, the "Real Spearfisherman" would want no part of shooting octopus in a petting zoo, so there is no offsetting fee potential for killed octopus revenue at this petting zoo.