How would you handle this?

[Zen Diving Inc.]

Well said, each of your posts ZD. I do think you were too critical of the intervention. If not someone like NWGD, then who? More police? He was involved first hand and made it personal. I think we'd be better off with more of that. Nothing wrong with toe to toe over conscience The mob thuggery is something else all together.

Too critical of the intervention? Yeah probably, but where does it stop. There are no SCUBA police, so I guess it's good that there are guys like Bob willing to stand up to these idiots. I never agreed with the manner of the kill. Nor do I agree with wiping the floor with this kid. The black sheep methodology just doesn't sit well with me. It doesn't set a good precedent. I have been sitting back reading this since the first post, the outcome likely will be not good for spear fisherman regardless of the intent. People love to take others rights way based on their beliefs, its contagious.

---------- Post Merged at 09:42 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:27 PM ----------

Michael,
As most here know, I spearfished myself for 3 decades, and will still spear in the future. But even guys I used to spear with like Frank Hammett or Pat Frain, would not think of shooting fish or octopus in a petting zoo ( or BHB marine park. )

I couldn't agree more... But I also think that we shouldn't alienate the spear fisherman just because there hunting fish someone might want to take a picture of... How fair is that. Who's to say the photographers should have more privileges, better access and amenities then hunters. I think the rule should be, if you can fish there with a pole then you can fish there with a spear period. I have to pay the same taxes that support those programs, my fishing license cost just as mush as the next guy.

 

[danvolker]

Back around 97 when I was big into freedive spearfishing out on the 60 foot reefs like Horsehoe and Pauls, I got to meet and dive with quite a few other spearfisherman. One day, I found a couple of the guys I had speared with, were whacking cudas at the tip of the South Jetty to the Palm Beach inlet..taking many dozens each day they did this, and they kept this up for a very long time...When I first found out, I confronted them, and told them how ignorant the behavior was...for one, they were pulling in the big bullsharks to an area less then a few hundred feet away from kids swimming....For another, killing hundreds of cuda to sell for cat meat at 25 cents a pound, just felt wrong.
Back in those days, there were walls of cuda all over many of the reefs and wrecks....walls....more than you could imagine or count....these guys helped make this disappear forever. Today we don't have cudas like this anymore. Some spearfisherman are not responsible, some govern themselves only by self interest, and some don't care if they cause the near extinction of a species--in all liklihood, they just don;t think or care about this.


In the 1800's, there were Buffalo hunters that went out, and shot hundreds of buffalo every day. It was legal. Was it right? Were these people just hunters, or were they the scum of the earth, soul-less killers that should have been killed by the Indians....

 

[TMHeimer]

There are points to be made by both sides re hunting where others dive. When I am on a charter and legally collect some shells I get them to my bag on deck as quickly and discretely as possible. If another diver happens to see my catch bag and asks, I just say "Oh, just some shells". It is unlikely he will then say "Well, none of them are alive are they"? Confrontation usually avoided. Then again, if you're haulin' around a Giant F*&%$#g Octopus.......

 

[Tigerman]

I dont think Id handle someone killing the main attraction of the reef very well, it being legal or not..
Its just inconsiderate and if its actually nesting, inconsiderate and EXTREMELY short-sighted.

Its kinda like thinking a cent today is better than a dollar tomorrow

 

[DaleC]

I have no objection to someone harvesting a GPO for food (even though I am a vegetarian and would not do so myself) but two points in this case, and an understanding of the GPO life cycle, makes this persons actions objectionable.

a.) Harvesting in a site like that impacts all divers by quickly denuding it. There are many many other easily accessible sites in the area for collecting and for one person to negatively impact so many other divers in this way is socially wrong.

b.) As stated earlier, harvesting a brooding female is environmentally wrong. It means death to all her unhatched offspring. I know of no responsible hunters who would subscribe to both the impact and method employed. Lazy and short sighted.

Yes, there is room in this world for people of differing beliefs to coexist but not if they have no regard for either social or environmental values. That actually creates a world wherein different values cannot coexist, as we see developing in this case. As for those who are so worried about pointing the finger; sitting on ones hands and dithering is what a person without regard would do. If spearo's or hunters are concerned about their rights they should police their own. Rec divers are concerned about their rights and are doing so. Don't defend inactivity by criticizing activity; that's the pathway to banality.

People of conscience sometimes need to take action. I am reminded of a quote:

"All that is needed for evil to flourish is for good men to stand by and do nothing"

Thanks Bob - for being a good man in this instance.

 

[Doubler]

Anybody notice that there appears to be a sad old man face on the GPO. Look at the main body.

 

[Allison Finch]

I am very grateful to NW for bringing thisto the public's attention.

This punk is a spoiled brat who needed to be "outed". Judging from this kids photos (before he made them private) he enjoyed torturing animals. He had a photo of a firecracker shoved in a captive snakes mouth?? You wanna bet he blew that snakes head up? What a PUNK!! Anyone who gets off killing that way needs a set down.

I spent my first 25 years as an avid spearfisher. I crewed on sailboats and my job was food provider. I did it well. BUT, I NEVER killed anything that wasn't eaten and I NEVER derived pleasure from the kill itself (though I loved the stalking). For this punk to have killed a brooding female proves that this was just a kill, not part of any sport. No one knowingly kills that which is providing for the future. His snark in bragging about the fact that the eggs were now unprotected was proof enough what kind of jerk he was.

He is like a kid who so desires any kind of attention he will even walk into a business/school with a gun to get it. He WILL be back at that site as he warned, just to get the attention. He will be thrilled if he can legally drag another one up right under your noses, just as a way to flip you off. Get that place PROTECTED from jerks like that....soon!!

I just hope his parents are really proud of their sociopathic kid who poses with his alcohol games (the only photo he left up to show what a charmer he is). A real poster child for the pro choice movement, IMHO.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Congratulations Bob for giving this a voice and I assume being part of getting the government to take action.

I love a happy ending.

Pete

Might not be so happy for me ... the kid's dad called me tonight and made threats about a lawsuit.

Oh well ... this IS America ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Allison Finch]

Your photos were taken in a public place where no one has an expectation of privacy...so no violation there. All of your speaking parts on the interviews were not slanderous. He has no standing, that I can see.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Too critical of the intervention? Yeah probably, but where does it stop. There are no SCUBA police, so I guess it's good that there are guys like Bob willing to stand up to these idiots. I never agreed with the manner of the kill. Nor do I agree with wiping the floor with this kid. The black sheep methodology just doesn't sit well with me. It doesn't set a good precedent. I have been sitting back reading this since the first post, the outcome likely will be not good for spear fisherman regardless of the intent. People love to take others rights way based on their beliefs, its contagious.

You're absolutely right ... we should just allow this to continue. They can clean out a dive site in a week ... completely legal. Then when there's nothing left to look at, folks will have to go to Florida and let you take them diving.

You are also wrong ... there are scuba police. There have to be, because the only way we're going to keep the government from policing us is to do it ourselves.

Which would you prefer, really?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)