Halcyon sueing OxyCheq, US Divers and others?

[5615mike]

No, I mean basis, as in basis in fact. Your Kool aid reference was enough insult which you reached for in knee jerk fashion. You attribute DIR as solely based on Halcyon Gear and cite their "Fundamentals" book as support for your position. Then, when argument is proffered in opposition to your viewpoint, you flame someone. The thread was started discussing a law suit in which a manufacturer is claiming patent infringement. This suit will work its way through a long judicial process before sufficient facts to support or deny their claim is at hand. You argue the merits of the case strictly on hearsay and turn it into an "us" vs. "DIR" argument. Why not wait and see the facts as presented in court before solidifying your opinion one way or the other?

In no way is this an us vs. DIR on my part. In fact, I agree with most of the "DIR" principles as well as gear configuration. I certainly don't hang on every word and believe everything they say or believe is gospel. My beef with the whole thing is just that, my beef. Listen steffen, my post was not directed at you in the first place. Boog is a big boy and he can handle himself just fine. No I don't attribute DIR as solely Halcyon Gear but they seem to think so. The whole attitude that the group is that if you don't use their principles and or gear your an accident waiting to happen and "we are far superior" I'm so tired of it I could throw up. They act like they created this "New" way of diving and it's just not true. They made some changes to principles that have been used by many for years and called it their own.
See steffen, if you would actually read ALL the posts leading up to my comment you might have a better grasp on my point at hand.

Boog said that Halcyon was "actually quite careful around the "H" word". My point to him was that is obviously not true when you see their printed material.

 

[OneBrightGator]

Why not wait and see the facts as presented in court before solidifying your opinion one way or the other?

Why wait? the information is out there, read it for yourself, there's a link to the suit and to the patents involved in it, no need to wait to see what is right in front of your face.

Ben

 

[The Fresh Prince]

Why wait? the information is out there, read it for yourself, there's a link to the suit and to the patents involved in it, no need to wait to see what is right in front of your face.

Ben

Ben, because the filing of a suit will have a prayer claiming several issues attached. This filing would not in turn be a "fact" on which I would form judgement. The defendant in the suit would also file a return prayer indicating their position. The "facts" would be decided on in court and then would be the basis on which "I " would form my uneducated opinion. There are always two sides to every story, I like to wait until I hear them both.

 

[caveseeker7]

Why wait? the information is out there, read it for yourself, there's a link to the suit and to the patents involved in it, no need to wait to see what is right in front of your face.

Ben, I don't know what you do professionally, are you a player in the legal arena? You seem to know where to find that sort of info quite well. So you might well grasp the issues better than I do.

As I from my amateurish point of view see it, there are two issues:
1. Were the patents granted properly?
2. Were the patents infringed?

While I read through the pdf file, and looked at the links, it's still all somewhat abstract for me. On TDS someone posted that non-removable weights were used on the Sea Hunt TV show a long time ago. If that's the case it should be easy enough to prove, and might well mean the patent shouldn't have been granted.
If the patents are rightfully granted, and were infringed upon, Carmichael has case, and I'm suprised it took him as long to enforce his patent.

Anybody would do so. I'm a photographer, I almost always keep the copyright to my images. If I see one of my pictures used for profit(making) without my permisson and/or due compensation I enforce that copyright.


Mike, there are a couple of OMS rigs in the Fundies book that are used to show how it's done wrong.

 

[AzAtty]

Why not wait and see the facts as presented in court before solidifying your opinion one way or the other?

Why wait? the information is out there, read it for yourself, there's a link to the suit and to the patents involved in it, no need to wait to see what is right in front of your face.

Ah yes, the only rule of the Court of Public Opinion: Crucify the innocent, canonize the guilty, all in perfectly ignorant bliss.

The fact of the matter is, no one here knows anything more than the bare allegations of the complaints and his or her subjective interpretation of the claims made in the patents. At least I haven't seen anything about the factual basis for the claims or defenses raised in the suit; just the standard Chicken Little cries of "the sky is falling."

There's a lot more to a patent suit than reading the complaint and looking at the patents. I've litigated a couple patents. The complaint tells you jack squat--especially the one jonnythan posted. Even the claims in the patent don't tell you what other products will necessarily infringe. The courts have an entire procedure for determining the scope of the claims after substantial discovery and expert testimony. Shoot, we're analyzing the issue in a vacuum, and the analysis is precisely what you'd expect to get in a vacuum--it sucks.

But what the heck? Let's all grab pitchforks and torches.

 

[LUBOLD8431]

But what the heck? Let's all grab pitchforks and torches.

I agree. Lets also bring some OMS bungee wings and some deluxe harnesses with ABS BP's, and steel stage bottles and make a big pile right in front of Halcyon and then lite the whole pile on fire... (kidding, BTW, otherwise, I might be sued by the big H).

 

[scubasean]

I agree. Lets also bring some OMS bungee wings and some deluxe harnesses with ABS BP's, and steel stage bottles and make a big pile right in front of Halcyon and then lite the whole pile on fire... (kidding, BTW, otherwise, I might be sued by the big H).

Sued for setting their competitors' gear on fire? Doubt it...

 

[scubasean]

Let's all grab pitchforks and torches.

I especially like the part about the torches...I don't have a pitchfork.

:banana:

 

[Northeastwrecks]

I'll loan you mine.

 

[AzAtty]

...pitchforks to puncture the double bladder wings, torches to burn off the bungees.

I knew you were a pyro at heart, 'sean.