Halcyon Weight Distribution

[GingerDives]

I know there has been a lot of discussion re: weight distribution with the Halcyon BPW, but I’d love some of your input and suggestions.

I am a small female recreational diver that uses a single tank AL80 setup in warm salt water. I use:
0 lbs with a rash guard or 1mm
1-2 pounds with a 3mm,
3-4 pounds with my 5mm
6 pounds with a 5mm wetsuit + 2mm hooded vest + neoprene tech shorts + 5mm booties and RK3 Fins (I am always cold so this is what I normally dive in)

I was using a Zeagle Zena and was able to distribute my weight between my integrated pockets and cam band. I recently purchased a Halcyon Aluminum Backplate (short) BPW setup. I love everything about it except I am struggling with my trim and am now foot heavy. I tried the same weight distribution as I was using with the Zena….4 pounds in the pockets and 2 on the upper cam band. But I was still foot heavy. No changes to any other conditions or equipment and my fins are slightly in positively buoyant.

So here are my questions.

I have a 6 pound channel weight. I know that diving with no ditchable weight is not advisable and Halcyon only has a 5.2lb and 6lb option available?? I’m in the US. Has anyone found a lighter that can be used that will fit the channel? Can a V-pouch be used?

Would using 2 trim pockets on either side of my upper tank straps give me the same trim as using the bar weight? If so, any recommendations on small low profile pockets?

I was also wondering if I could possibly mount something to the inside of the plate? I’ll attach photos of the plate for reference.

Thank you so much in advance. You all have been a great resource in the past.

 

[rongoodman]

With that little weight a pair of trim pockets on your waist belt should do it, or you could move them to the upper or lower tank bands. Channel weights are for double tanks, sitting in the space between them and the plate(unless you’re talking about the weight in the weighted STA). I used the Halcyon trim pockets on both upper cam band and waist belt for a long time, but switched out the waist to the ACB system after this last trip out to Cocos, when I nearly lost a weight while donning the rig sitting on the side of a panga.

(Agree completely with the poster below about confusing foot-heavy with head-heavy. Posture plays a role too. If you relax your back and glutes too much, your knees are going to drop, no matter what.)

 

[crofrog]

I know there has been a lot of discussion re: weight distribution with the Halcyon BPW, but I’d love some of your input and suggestions.

I am a small female recreational diver that uses a single tank AL80 setup in warm salt water. I use:
0 lbs with a rash guard or 1mm
1-2 pounds with a 3mm,
3-4 pounds with my 5mm
6 pounds with a 5mm wetsuit + 2mm hooded vest + neoprene tech shorts + 5mm booties and RK3 Fins (I am always cold so this is what I normally dive in)

I have 3 ladies on our team that were all new divers when they started diving and they all run halcyon bpw with single tanks (as well as doubles) so I've worked through these issues with them a few times.

They run a combination of weighted single tank adapters, trim weight pouches and the halcyon ACB pouches on the waist belt depending on exposure protection.

So here are my questions.

I have a 6 pound channel weight. I know that diving with no ditchable weight is not advisable and Halcyon only has a 5.2lb and 6lb option available?? I’m in the US. Has anyone found a lighter that can be used that will fit the channel? Can a V-pouch be used?

The halcyon weighted STA is 5.2lb of lead for the removable weighed insert. The single tank adapter is about 2.3lb by itself.

The v-weight pouch only works with doubles as it goes between the tanks and the plate in the space created by the bands between the tanks.

I don't think that diving without ditch able weight is a problem assuming you can build a balanced rig. A balanced rig is defined as something that you can swim up if your wing fails from the deepest and heaviest part of your dive while also being just heavy enough to hold your shallowest stop with all of the gas out of your wing.

The heaviest point of your dive is when the tank is completely full and you're at the max depth because of neoprene compression, and the lightest spot is the end of the dive at your shallowest stop.

Assuming you can satisfy those 2 criteria and I imagine you could with only 6lb of weight needed, then you don't need to worry about ditching weight, but it's easy to test next time you're out.

Would using 2 trim pockets on either side of my upper tank straps give me the same trim as using the bar weight? If so, any recommendations on small low profile pockets?

The weighted single tank adapter is feels very similar to diving with just a heavier backplate like a stainless steel one. It sort of pushes you down from the middle it would be where I would start for 6lb of weight personally. Putting 2 weigh pockets on the upper cam band would put more weight by your head than the weighted STA.

For the low profile weight pockets I'd do the Halcyon trim pockets or Diverite travel pockets, and just stick them both on the upper cam band as close to the backplate as you can get them.

I was also wondering if I could possibly mount something to the inside of the plate? I’ll attach photos of the plate for reference.View attachment 817440

There are things called "p-weights" that bolt inside the channel of the plate. They can be hard to find and frequently you have to make your own.


My only other word of caution is make sure you're truly head light / feet heavy. I've see a lot of divers who are diving with negative "head up" trim and are actually head heavy and they have to drop their feet to become balanced. I'd recommend getting completely flat in the water and turning off all of your muscles and make sure your feet drop if you haven't. It's very non-intuitive and I and a bunch of people I know have chased their own tail thinking they were foot heavy.

I also think with wearing a double layer of neoprene you could find that the trim characteristics at depth are different than when shallow because of the extra 2mm of neoprene up there.

I see your in PA if you wanted to come down to the Rockville, MD area for a pool session or the likes you could try some of the different combo's we have to see what you actually want to spend your money on. I'm not an instructor.

 

[MidOH]

I use these instead of weight pockets.

Put them on the bottom half of the shoulder straps or waist belt. They seem to hang nicely, just off my ribcage, which helps get weight forward, but still low.

I also use 2 weights on a weight belt.
So I'm properly weighted while my rig floats alongside me. Donning in the water is one of the biggest quarry perks.

Move the wing down, and the tank up.

 

[JoeTPhilly]

I think you will find this video helpful:

 

[GingerDives]

With that little weight a pair of trim pockets on your waist belt should do it, or you could move them to the upper or lower tank bands. Channel weights are for double tanks, sitting in the space between them and the plate(unless you’re talking about the weight in the weighted STA). I used the Halcyon trim pockets on both upper cam band and waist belt for a long time, but switched out the waist to the ACB system after this last trip out to Cocos, when I nearly lost a weight while donning the rig sitting on the side of a panga.

(Agree completely with the poster below about confusing foot-heavy with head-heavy. Posture plays a role too. If you relax your back and glutes too much, your knees are going to drop, no matter what.)

Sorry for the confusion. I did mean the weighted bar for the STA. I have not used it yet as I was unsure if it would compromise my ability to swim my rig up in an emergency. I will definitely try to pay more attention to my posture to see if I am indeed foot heavy. I just noticed that 1. I had to put air in my bcd to keep me neutral at depth (which I normally do not have to do) and 2. If I was not kicking, I would start to sink feet down. But I know this could have been nerves and just getting use to new equipment. Thanks for the input!!

 

[GingerDives]

I use these instead of weight pockets.
View attachment 817466

Put them on the bottom half of the shoulder straps or waist belt. They seem to hang nicely, just off my ribcage, which helps get weight forward, but still low.

I also use 2 weights on a weight belt.
So I'm properly weighted while my rig floats alongside me. Donning in the water is one of the biggest quarry perks.

Move the wing down, and the tank up.

I will definitely try these. They seem simple enough to use. Thanks for the recommendation.

 

[GingerDives]

I have 3 ladies on our team that were all new divers when they started diving and they all run halcyon bpw with single tanks (as well as doubles) so I've worked through these issues with them a few times.

They run a combination of weighted single tank adapters, trim weight pouches and the halcyon ACB pouches on the waist belt depending on exposure protection.



The halcyon weighted STA is 5.2lb of lead for the removable weighed insert. The single tank adapter is about 2.3lb by itself.

The v-weight pouch only works with doubles as it goes between the tanks and the plate in the space created by the bands between the tanks.

I don't think that diving without ditch able weight is a problem assuming you can build a balanced rig. A balanced rig is defined as something that you can swim up if your wing fails from the deepest and heaviest part of your dive while also being just heavy enough to hold your shallowest stop with all of the gas out of your wing.

The heaviest point of your dive is when the tank is completely full and you're at the max depth because of neoprene compression, and the lightest spot is the end of the dive at your shallowest stop.

Assuming you can satisfy those 2 criteria and I imagine you could with only 6lb of weight needed, then you don't need to worry about ditching weight, but it's easy to test next time you're out.


The weighted single tank adapter is feels very similar to diving with just a heavier backplate like a stainless steel one. It sort of pushes you down from the middle it would be where I would start for 6lb of weight personally. Putting 2 weigh pockets on the upper cam band would put more weight by your head than the weighted STA.

For the low profile weight pockets I'd do the Halcyon trim pockets or Diverite travel pockets, and just stick them both on the upper cam band as close to the backplate as you can get them.


There are things called "p-weights" that bolt inside the channel of the plate. They can be hard to find and frequently you have to make your own.


My only other word of caution is make sure you're truly head light / feet heavy. I've see a lot of divers who are diving with negative "head up" trim and are actually head heavy and they have to drop their feet to become balanced. I'd recommend getting completely flat in the water and turning off all of your muscles and make sure your feet drop if you haven't. It's very non-intuitive and I and a bunch of people I know have chased their own tail thinking they were foot heavy.

I also think with wearing a double layer of neoprene you could find that the trim characteristics at depth are different than when shallow because of the extra 2mm of neoprene up there.

I see your in PA if you wanted to come down to the Rockville, MD area for a pool session or the likes you could try some of the different combo's we have to see what you actually want to spend your money on. I'm not an instructor.

So the single weight adapters could be used alone? And I may take you up on your offer as I really could benefit from having someone on the water with me to help! I am definitely not 100% sure I am foot heavy as you said. I just noticed that I was needing air in my bcd to get neutral at depth (which I normally do not….just use my breath) and I felt like I constantly needed to kick or I would start to sink feet down. This could also be due to the diving conditions - I was is South Florida with ripping currents and swells.

 

[crofrog]

So the single weight adapters could be used alone? And I may take you up on your offer as I really could benefit from having someone on the water with me to help! I am definitely not 100% sure I am foot heavy as you said. I just noticed that I was needing air in my bcd to get neutral at depth (which I normally do not….just use my breath) and I felt like I constantly needed to kick or I would start to sink feet down. This could also be due to the diving conditions - I was is South Florida with ripping currents and swells.

Yes.

Not the best pictures but I was cleaning some gear up.

The sta comes with a bolt kit so that you can use it when not using the weight insert

 

[JoeTPhilly]

Crofrog gave great tips; especially this:

"My only other word of caution is make sure you're truly head light / feet heavy. I've see a lot of divers who are diving with negative "head up" trim and are actually head heavy and they have to drop their feet to become balanced." Check out the video I linked as it may help you visualize.

I have a feeling you are actually head heavy and are in negative trim to compensate. Where do you place your top tank strap relative to the tank? Also, you might want to check on the crotch strap being too lose causing the tank to ride up. Check out this other video which might help you visualize: