General Vortex Incident Discussion

[ucfdiver]

Oh, by the way, your cylinders are not trimmed properly in your photo...

Completely agree, Rob. Might have to sign up for a class with you to get some help. Judging from the videos posted, I'm sure you'd do a heck of a lot better than Ben's instructor.

 

[cavediver256]

Completely agree, Rob. Might have to sign up for a class with you to get some help. Judging from the videos posted, I'm sure you'd do a heck of a lot better than Ben's instructor.

ROTFLMAO !!!!!!!

 

[Rick Murchison]

Bob, I suggest going to Singapore and seeing it for yourself. Thats what I did.

Been there many times. There's more opportunity to go fast on curvy road between Montgomery and Tuscaloosa than on the entire Island of Singapore. Traffic stats are meaningless between here and there.
Rick

 

[PfcAJ]

And I'm sure the drivers are just as good there as they are here...

 

[Divedoggie]

A little recap of the original topic.

So, the family and the sheriff are convinced that Ben went past the deepest restriction and died there.

Experts on the scene reported that there is no evidence that anyone has been that far back in years. There are no scratch marks, and the restriction is only 4 inches wide. Ben's head, esp. with helmet, is way bigger than that.
I may be mistaken, but the tanks in the recent foto appear to be 8 inchers.

The gas necessary to reach the last restriction doesn't seem to have been carried or staged.
Ben was a biggish guy who supposedly squeezed through a 4 inch gap?
Ben's skills demonstrated in Deepswim's video shot only a couple of weeks before the disappearance, were not likely solid enough to make it past the first restriction.

Thermal protection was inadequate.
UK SL4 lights as primarys, DIN to Yoke on one valve, No regs on staged bottles, ....

Was either diving air or a very lean Nitrox which could have resulted in narcosis, and which coupled with an equipment failure or silt out, ended with some bizarre and unimaginable decisions. Perhaps resulting in a fast exit from the cave, a fast ascent with no deco, a brain injury, and a John Doe wandering around FL or lying somewhere in the woods outside of the general Vortex area.

He may have been a really nice and fun guy, but in another life, evidence shows he was devious, reckless, self important, disrespectful, a risk taker, and consistently ignored authority. (Broke thru grate, refused education, posted exploits, joined the ridiculous fray in the piano room video, and directly ignored warnings.)

This "other side" of Ben is what either got him killed, or would make NOT being in the cave plausible.

I'm interested to read what everyone thinks. Unless there is unpublished evidence beyond the cadaver dogs tracking to the water's edge, I'm going to have to go with the overwhelming evidence that he isn't in there.

 

[DaleC]

It's very funny that (at the core of things) some posters only really seem to be frustrated at caves being closed to them because of the decisions of others. Seems that Ben felt that way too.

 

[PfcAJ]

I really hope he isn't.

Can we go do my water test now? Looks like the family is willing to pay people to dive there.

 

[ucfdiver]

I really hope he isn't.

Can we go do my water test now? Looks like the family is willing to pay people to dive there.

I'm wondering what they'll pay to look. Go down and hang out for an hour or two for how much $$?

 

[Hetland]

Thanks Divedoggie for (hopefully) steering this Titanic back on topic.

You've also done a great job summing up the facts and circumstances currently available to us. As for your question, I'm split. I think the chances are even that he's in the cave or on a beach in Mexico.

 

[Rick Murchison]

Limit instructors to the demand, or as many as you can manage.

Require the student to fill out a dive log for every dive, 1 paragraph. Depth, time, passage, etc. Write what happened, what THEY did wrong, how they will fix it. It would make a great record for the student as well. Would be good for records for the instructor for insurance, and the agency could see what's going on. Sure, you could lie, but very few students would be down to lie on a course they're paying for about short cutting skills.

For basic cave, video valve drills, s drills, lost line w/ blacked out mask, on line exits, etc. UW cameras can be had less then the cost of 1 students tuition, mail in a $0.50 cd that teh agencies can randomly review. Doesn't have to be professional quality, just show the student what he/she did wrong, and show the agency that drills were done.

And would your "requirements" have the force of law? Would there be fines and other penalties for violating them? If not, how would you propose to enforce them?
There is simply no public safety issue in diving; a drunk solo untrained cave diver isn't likely to kill you in a head-on collision. So while I'm all for the availability of the very best training, I'm also for personal freedom... even the freedom to be terminally stupid... and for the bureaucrats to stay away... way, way away... from diving.
Rick