Gear returned from servicing with issue

[SlugLife]

People disagreeing with what I said above are simply disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing not because there is anything wrong with what I suggested. One has to take responsibility and control of their safety and not lay the blame on others. When the diver is hurt, they are hurt not the LDS.

I've seen enough of your posts, that I gave you the benefit of the doubt, and tried to inject that nuance into the conversation. To be completely fair, how you said it could easily be interpreted to mean it was only the responsibility of the scuba-diver to check the shop's work, and not the responsibility or "job" of the scuba-shop to check their own work, handing the diver a piece of gear that was safe and ready to use.

Any shop which didn't adequately tighten hoses, etc, IMO, didn't do their job, is dangerous, and should never be used to service gear. A diver should double-check the work anyway. I'd also add that I was never taught to double-check recently serviced gear, nor how to check it in my OW course. It might actually be a good resource for divers to have a checklist for each type of gear, and how it should be checked after servicing.

Second, it is your job to check your equipment BEFORE going in the water, not them. You are really the person to blame for the issue that occurred underwater with the valve. Equipment check is part of every single diver training course out there. It is part of basic training.

 

[BoltSnap]

Any shop which didn't adequately tighten hoses, etc, IMO, didn't do their job, is dangerous, and should never be used to service gear. A diver should double-check the work anyway.

They are negligent and responsible most likely if you are hurt but I don't want to get hurt and I don't take anyone's word for it.

I am not talking about redoing the service, just overall check before leaving the LDS or several days before the trip.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Agreed. If you get an oil-change, you shouldn't have to also check their work. I pay them to do the job, so I don't have to. I know how to change the oil myself, swap brake-pads, and a bunch of other things. But I also don't quite have the same level of tools, experience, indoor work-garage, lift, etc.

That said, I often do check auto-shop's work, just because I've been screwed before, and have some basic knowledge how to double-check the work. Maybe the oil is low, or they didn't replace the filter, etc. But the average person might now know how or what to check. (and for some jobs, it might surpass my knowledge).

I don't think your average scuba-diver straight out of OW knows how to check recently serviced gear. I didn't.

I'm perhaps nit-picking and agree with your overall post. I understand your analogy, but some software engineers are mechanically smart. Hell, some software engineers are even good artists, even if somewhat rare.

"Mechanical" stuff is often how I take a break from staring at a computer screen. It can take a variety of forms, even cooking, or various forms of DIY. I'm sure I'd be a lot better at mechanical tasks if I had the training, time, and focus or did it as a job. But servicing regulators isn't exactly "rocket science" when it comes to mechanics.

I trust myself more than an LDS, not because I'm better than them at servicing regulators, but rather because I care more about ensuring I do it right, and don't have a pile of 50+ customer regulators to churn through.

I'm not surprised to see a former dive center owner be defensive about this. Maybe this is why he closed his dive center, because he had to? I have had issues with dry suits being serviced, exhaust valves not being installed correctly (no pressure test was performed obviously).

The defense of "it is your life if you don't check your gear", unlike an improperly serviced dry suit, doesn't hold water. These are all inconveniences at best where dives are missed, but no one dies. That's just nonsense.

The dive industry isn't any different than any other industry where services are to be checked by the provider prior to returning to the customer. It is incredibly unprofessional to blame an amateur diver for equipment problems. While I teach valve and leak tests in my dry suit course, I sure wasn't taught that in my course which did meet standards, so the training claim is nonsense too.

And we wonder why the industry shrinks.

Take care of divers with proper training and proper service, and maybe some of the people who stop diving might continue instead.

 

[lexvil]

Mistakes happen even for those of us who do our own work/service, for a shop their response to a mistake is the best indicator to future quality.

it’s the possibility of these mistakes that should lead us to at least a cursory inspection, not only after service but prior to any dive.

 

[Landau]

unlike an improperly serviced dry suit, doesn't hold water.

I loved this line! Outstanding writing skills!

 

[SlugLife]

The dive industry isn't any different than any other industry where services are to be checked by the provider prior to returning to the customer. It is incredibly unprofessional to blame an amateur diver for equipment problems. While I teach valve and leak tests in my dry suit course, I sure wasn't taught that in my course which did meet standards, so the training claim is nonsense too.

And we wonder why the industry shrinks.

Take care of divers with proper training and proper service, and maybe some of the people who stop diving might continue instead.

At the end of my OW course, I didn't even really understand what the whole "regulator" thing was. I mean, I knew how to check pressure, there was a thing that attached to the tank, and I had 2 breathing devices. But I thought the term "octo" referred to the spaghetti of hoses. I didn't quite fully understand that a regulator was configurable, and built out of individual components, and you could swap hoses, devices, etc. Fast forward, and I service my own 1st and 2nd stages, which is multitudes more complex than that basic 101-level knowledge.

I have a similar view of redundant air. Yeah, maybe divers don't have to have it, but if it were up to me, I'd give open-water divers a very basic overview and at least set them on the path of maybe getting one in the foreseeable future. If you do it right, a pony-bottle can be somewhat of a one-time expense, and a similar price as a month of health-insurance. It may save your life, or save you from PTSD because of some regulator failure at 90ft.

 

[James79]

People disagreeing with what I said above are simply disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing not because there is anything wrong with what I suggested. One has to take responsibility and control of their safety and not lay the blame on others. When the diver is hurt, they are hurt not the LDS.

How magnanimous of you to assign motives. Prior to this I'm sure none of them new why they disagreed! I, for one, disagree with the implication that the OP is to blame for the failure of the shop to tighten a valve that they disassemble during a paid for servicing. I would agree with the opinion (as @SlugLife mentioned) that pre-inspections can catch a fault (that shouldn't have existed in the first place!), but the OP not noticing/checking before the dive that the shop did THEIR job correctly does not equate the OP being to blame. Calling out the failure of the shop IS "laying blame on others".... laying it squarely where it belongs, in this case.

However, the fact of where blame lies doesn't change where the immediate effect happens.... and we all have to determine just how in depth we are going to check up behind the "professionals" we pay to do things.

Respectfully,

James

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

It just happened to me. Sent my drysuit in to Bare (via my LDS) to get a quickneck and new boots installed.

First dive afterwards I descended to 8 m, went to adjust my dump valve and it came unscrewed in my hand. The inner portion slid over a bit so I couldn't get it rethreaded and tightened at depth or easily at the surface, with lots of water pouring in each time I tried. I'm assuming they took it off and never retightened it correctly.

Needed to swim back to shore while holding the valve in place, where I could get my shoulder high enough above water so I could easily adjust the inner portion without more water coming in and screw it back together. Swam back out and completed a cold, wet dive as the water migrated all around my suit. At the end of the dive only my feet and right arm were dry. Walking back to the parking lot saw water run down to my feet and get them soaked too. I dumped out a couple litres of water and still had very heavy soaked undergarments.

The good news is after a thorough drying the suit is now leak free and better than ever.

Moral of the story - check your gear after servicing - especially if you are about to head out on a trip.

I should add that all the servicing my LDS has done in-house on my regs has been flawless, never an issue with them.

If you are interested in a video call to go over some ways I check my dry suit, let me know. This is open to all, welll .... except those who blame the OP

 

[Landau]

If you are interested in a video call to go over some ways I check my dry suit, let me know

Thanks for the offer, but I think I'm set. One more thing - well two more, one for each valve - to add to my pre dive routine. Along with checking that my Aqua-Lung "Sure-Loss" weight pockets are secure 5 times each.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Thanks for the offer, but I think I'm set. One more thing - well two more, one for each valve - to add to my pre dive routine. Along with checking that my Aqua-Lung "Sure-Loss" weight pockets are secure 5 times each.

Don't be so careless. 10 times minimum each.