Diver Training: How much is enough?

[Thalassamania]

I'm not convinced that "making it difficult" equates to "making it better", which is the assumption underlying many comments like this. However, I certainly appreciate the attitude of commitment, dedication to good results and wanting the divers to get the best training possible.

While making it difficult is no guarantee that it is better, that is not to say that you can reach a significantly higher level of performance without having some people identify what you doing as being more difficult, if just because it takes more time or more effort, or both.

And that's the big issue I see with scuba training. There are too many lazy and/or incompetent instructors out there who are violating standards every single day, and THAT, in my humble opinion, is what is watering down the training. We can have all the standards in the world but unless it's policed and instructors are held to the bar of "mastery" before approving a skill, then nothing much will improve.

Most of those lazy and/or incompetent instructors out there who are violating standards every single day, in my experience, point the finger at those of us who teach more complete classes and accuse us of making it more difficult or not providing what the public wants. Which is not to say that every instructor with that complaint is lazy or incompetent of not meeting standards.

So instructors, take note. Look in a mirror and remind yourself of the definition of "mastery" before you approve any/all skills and you'll find that your results improve dramatically overnight. Because "demonstrating" something and "mastering" something are not the same!

R..

Spot on!

It's a common fallacy that a class has to be tough and/or lengthy to be thorough. The essence of a great instructor is their ability to make the tough simple, the hard easy and change the long and drawn out into fun and efficient. A few want to call this a dumbing down, when it's actually a funning up. The last thing I need or want is a former student of mine silting out the place or running out of air like a complete noob. Ergo, my training focuses on being trim and neutral as well as buddy and gas management. To be frank, (sorry Wookie) those are the very same things that I see lacking in many certified divers: even those that have taken long and hard classes.

In real life, every instructor has a different emphasis on their training. Some harp on not touching the pool walls and I have even seen them slap hands. Oh my! Some focus so much on self rescue that their students are scared stiff to get in the water lest they find themselves in a real emergency. Most are fairly balanced, but we all have our quirks. That's OK as our differences go a long way to keep us honestly striving for excellence. The only instructor I have a real problem with is the one that is focused on completing their routine as fast as possible with as little care or effort as they can get by with. Yeah, they're out there, but they are few and far between.

One of things I really emphasize with my students are limits. While it's obvious that air/time/depth have to be considered on each and every dive, all too often they don't realize that skill, physical fitness, training, conditions, support, buddies and more should also be considered on each and every dive. To paraphrase Dirty Harry, a diver has to know their limitations. As long as they respect those limitations, they'll do just fine.

If one chooses to teach a course that saddles a graduate with less limitations that course will be longer and likely more difficult and in comparison many other courses will be reasonably seen as dumbed down.

 

[The Chairman]

If one chooses to teach a course that saddles a graduate with less limitations

What limitations have you eliminated? Aren't there additional limitations that your students have to meet as well in regards to support and planning?

that course will be longer and likely more difficult and in comparison many other courses will be reasonably seen as dumbed down.

No, it will only be promoted as such to justify the longer time involved. You can make learning anything longer and harder if that's your goal. While it might assuage the ego of the student and instructor that they really had it tough, it doesn't automatically equate to being a superior method. There's a not so new concept that has swept the country: work smarter, not harder. That can also be paraphrased into "teach smarter, not harder". In that respect, modern (as opposed to antiquated) diving agencies have adopted a modular approach to learning how to dive. Rather than force each and every student to go all the way through Rescue Diver before they are allowed to dive on their own, they have have designed a progressive style to learning how to dive. It's only "dumbed down" in your eyes because they don't teach Scuba your way.

In the end, each and every diver should know and honor their limitations. Time, depth, gas, conditions, physical abilities, skill levels and certification levels should all be assessed by each and every diver (and their buddy) for each and every dive. Tourist divers subsequently need less training than research divers who in turn need less training than technical divers who in turn need less training than expedition divers. It's up to the diver to be sure that they don't exceed their limitations and that they seek additional training and/or experience before they attempt dives that will. After all, it's their butt on the line.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

More time often means more practice and more practice often means improvement. Harder is often defined as being able to transition from dialing-in the big picture items to the dialing-in the small picture items. My classes are thought to be "hard" because every time we reach a certain level of proficiency I seek to reach for the next rung on the ladder. But, given time constraints we can only climb as high as the speed of mastery and time allows. I use a building block approach. We repeat things until the skill is solid enough to allow for the next more difficult portion of a skill or combination of skills.

For example, when teaching the S-drill the first attempt for the students usually results in just being able to "plug the hole," really blowing the standards of buoyancy and trim, getting light cord and long hose entangled and by the time they are done I have stolen 100% of everything that isn't nailed down.

Given enough time and practice, the students gain the ability to perform the skill with 100% demonstration quality, in less than the 3 foot window I'm hoping to achieve, with near-perfect or perfect trim, with the self-awareness and team awareness to not let me steal anything, while the leader maintains directional awareness of his compass so the team maintains a fixed position and doesn't "wagon-wheel" in blue water, while launching a DSMB, and experiencing a right post failure which they smartly decide not to shut down and deprive the OOG diver of gas.

Once we can stay still then we start doing all that while routing the hose to move in the left side, right side and tandem positions while ascending through deco stops and navigating while swimming. Once we can do that, then I engage their brains with failures that start easy and increase in complexity as the students get better at problem recognition, resolution, verification and decision.

"Smart" training means, "How do I get them here in the quickest amount of time, while making it fun, keeping them motivated, and eliminating the frustration that comes with the mistakes that will be made as they work to really 'get it' and make it look easy?"

 

[DCBC]

...You can make learning anything longer and harder if that's your goal. While it might assuage the ego of the student and instructor that they really had it tough, it doesn't automatically equate to being a superior method...

I don't know any Instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver if they double or quadruple the amount of training time. If more training doesn't equate to better, you should quit teaching!

We must always ask the question: "What is the goal of the program?" This must be known before it can be accomplished in a satisfactory manner. After the program, will the Diver have enough ability to dive unsupervised? Will they be prepared to dive as a valuable member of a Buddy team (will they be able to render assistance above and below the water)? Are they capable of planning a dive and projecting air consumption at depth? What should be required to be 'mastered' prior to certification? Is the Diver aware of his 'diving envelope?' Is the certification restricted to these conditions?

The final question that I see is the definition of diver competency and the degree to which incompetency equates to unreasonable and unacceptable risk. To define this, we first must understand the environment in-which the diver will be diving in. Warm, clear vacation diving does not require the same skill-sets as cold water with limited visibility involving current, waves and surf. One fixed program will not deliver what is needed, unless it's designed for the worst conditions and that just isn't the case.

...Tourist divers subsequently need less training than research divers who in turn need less training than technical divers who in turn need less training than expedition divers. It's up to the diver to be sure that they don't exceed their limitations and that they seek additional training and/or experience before they attempt dives that will....

I agree; however in some circumstances, the new diver isn't prepared to dive safely in local conditions and is too often certified anyway.

 

[The Chairman]

I don't know any Instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver if they double or quadruple the amount of training time.

I don't know any instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver in less time if they improved their efficiency while teaching. If you are unwilling to improve your efficiency, you should quit teaching. I teach in a modular fashion that maximizes fun and leverages experience. The OW module is a learning permit and includes everything they need to determine if any particular dive is within their limits or if they need additional training and/or gear.

 

[The Chairman]

"Smart" training means, "How do I get them here in the quickest amount of time, while making it fun, keeping them motivated, and eliminating the frustration that comes with the mistakes that will be made as they work to really 'get it' and make it look easy?"

More words to live and teach by. Good stuff!

 

[Diver0001]

I don't know any instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver in less time if they improved their efficiency while teaching.

I don't know any Instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver if they double or quadruple the amount of training time

I think both of these statements hold water to a point. Efficiency has its limitations and even very efficient instructors need a certain amount of time on average for every student. Likewise, more time sounds appealing and certainly a great many instructors could benefit from having more time for training, but this is a game of diminishing returns. At some point more time is just "wasting" time in the sense suggested by "Parkinson's Law".

R..

 

[TSandM]

eliminating the frustration that comes with the mistakes that will be made as they work to really 'get it'

If you have managed to do this, Trace, you are truly gifted! In my experience, training like you describe usually consists of throwing all that noise at the students and sitting back and watching them try to sort it out, and then debriefing them on how badly they screwed up. Although I generally approve of scenario-based training for technical divers, it has a LOT of frustration built into it.

 

[thez_yo]

Me? I took PADI Open Water (or it took me?), decided I couldn't dive by myself with a buddy yet so I took PADI's Advanced Open Water. Went on a couple dives... still didn't feel too confident. Took ESM with UTD (no ocean dives in this one)... feel better but still wouldn't go diving by myself. Want to be buddied with someone vastly more knowledgeable than myself still so signed up for Nitrox - realizing PADI's Nitrox class doesn't have dives included with it signed up to go join someone else's Nitrox dives (with an instructor) that are a 'class extension' at this point, and am still waiting on taking Essentials of Rec with UTD before I go out in the ocean by myself with a buddy again. Hopefully then I'll feel more prepared. Before I have dive #17, I will have taken 5 courses from two different agencies from three different shops and... maybe 5-8 different instructors. And will have dived with backmount, sidemount, those gigantic rental bcs, back inflate, bp/w, and hopefully have learned frog-kick How otherwise are you supposed to figure out what you're doing if you don't even know all the choices e.g. bc styles?

Were I in Key Largo instead of San Diego, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have felt I needed this much, but it's good I'm seeing worse-than-calm-bathtub conditions so early on I'm getting to see that I can get in over my head (pun intended ) real fast if I'm not 100% paying attention to everything I need to be during the dive. And honestly I feel like Rescue would be a good course to know so I'm not lost if my buddy has an actual vs. class-simulated emergency (I've been in such a situation that could have turned ugly... thank... I guess poseidon the DM's saw it and swam over and helped :shocked2, but I don't feel like my dive skills are good enough to actually be able to take such a course. Being a newbie is hard.

Yeah yeah, I get that everyone says, "ok you have OW now go dive dive dive!" instead of taking this many courses, but I feel like I'd be ill-prepared for the conditions here and would just be the worst buddy ever.

 

[DCBC]

I don't know any instructor worth his salt that can't produce a better diver in less time if they improved their efficiency while teaching. If you are unwilling to improve your efficiency, you should quit teaching. I teach in a modular fashion that maximizes fun and leverages experience. The OW module is a learning permit and includes everything they need to determine if any particular dive is within their limits or if they need additional training and/or gear.

The efficiency of any instructor is always subject to improvement. Regardless, if it was established that you could certify your average student in 25 hours of training (regardless of your efficiency) are you saying that if you trained that student for 50 hours, you wouldn't see an increase in diver competence?

If it took you 25 hours to reach the 'minimum level' and it took me 30 hours (who knows it could be the other way around), where is the benefit to the student? We both bring the student to the goal. The difference is, you stop at 25 and I train to 50 hours. Anyway you look at it, the Student has the advantage and not the dive shop (who makes more money because of less overhead).

I think that good diving instruction depends less upon the Instructor and more on the time of the program (in university if I depended upon the Profs alone, I'd never have graduated). This is especially true with on-line learning in diving education; the Instructor's role has been diminished. People often need more time for them to build confidence and gain necessary skill-sets.

Once the cry of the industry was quality education; now it's make as much profit as you can! If you extended the time of your training program, expanding the curriculum, you would be surprised at what your students would accomplish! Comparing them to previous students would be the difference of night and day.