Dive sites//charters solo diving

[k-valve]

You're going a little overboard here. Gulf Diving is doing what their insurance company has instructed them to do. Solo diving has shown a greater level of risk in diving than any of your other listed activities.

TwoBit

Agreed...

If the dive community does their part to keep the attorneys at bay (proper training, certs, & equipment) and the dive operators do their part to keep the lawyers away (policies, insurance, etc) then there is no reason for anyone to be sued. If there is no one to sue then the lawyers go away. That's how capitalism works. If there is little or no money to be made then the business either goes away or is pared down to scale.

 

[Teknadv3x]

K valve I disagree with there is no reason for anyone to be sued. It is all about the money that the PI attorneys want. Which is sad but very true. Everyone signs a waiver stating that they will not hold the operators responsible if something happens lot of good that does in a court of law. I thought it was pretty black & white. However you let PI lawyers have a day in court and see how the waiver holds up. The only thing that stops lawyers is tort reform. So contact your congressman and put pressure on them. The state of Florida has always been out in the forefront when it came to liability issues pertaining to diving accidents. We should learn from them. We need to hold people accountable for their own knucklehead actions. I raised my kids already I do not want to be a friggin babysitter.

Pearldiver07 hit it right on the head: a lawyer discovered the cert exists, and thought he had leverage.

I agree with Texdiveguy 100% :we all should respect and obey the rules enforced by the dive operators (parks//boats).....**never dive beyond ones skill/experience/training/gear.....use common sense

 

[scubadale]

I went overboard as that is what any PI attorney would do in court. They look for anything possible and present it to an uninformed public (jury) to point the blame at whomever has the money.

We should respect and obey the rules set forth from the dive ops but I would hope that they are willing to listen to other points of view as I think has been the case with this thread.

 

[k-valve]

K valve I disagree with there is no reason for anyone to be sued. It is all about the money that the PI attorneys want. Which is sad but very true.

I'd say it's mostly about the money for the attorneys involved. I don't think that's as true about the victim's family.

Everyone signs a waiver stating that they will not hold the operators responsible if something happens lot of good that does in a court of law. I thought it was pretty black & white. However you let PI lawyers have a day in court and see how the waiver holds up.

It's not about the waiver. It's about being responsible and doing the right thing. Waiver's only protect businesses when they have the proper rules, policies and procedures in place. If they don't and something happens to one of their customers they are asking to be sued. That's one reason why Frank requires a solo card.

I don't like it anymore than anyone else. It's just the way it is.

The only thing that stops lawyers is tort reform. So contact your congressman and put pressure on them. The state of Florida has always been out in the forefront when it came to liability issues pertaining to diving accidents. We should learn from them. We need to hold people accountable for their own knucklehead actions. I raised my kids already I do not want to be a friggin babysitter.

You're preaching to the choir, but until we do have tort reform we have to work within to system we have to protect ourselves and our sport.

Pearldiver07 hit it right on the head: a lawyer discovered the cert exists, and thought he had leverage.

Maybe, but I think having the cert comes closer to putting an end to the issue than not. I doubt the outcome would have been different if the cert didn't exist. We all know the majority of the dive industry and their insurance companies frown on solo diving. We also know the reality is many of us who are more experienced solo dive on a regular basis. If solo diving was more accepted (in general) the problem wouldn't be as prevalent either.

I agree with Texdiveguy 100% :we all should respect and obey the rules enforced by the dive operators (parks//boats).....**never dive beyond ones skill/experience/training/gear.....use common sense

Well, who wouldn't agree with that? Of course, we want everyone to dive within their limits. It just makes good sense. The reality is that it doesn't happen though.

 

[scubashawn123]

Just in off the wire, thanks PvilleStang.........from post on
"Man bitten by shark........."

. In the case of Groh, (australian diver who died in Bahama shark dive) the question is whether the tour operator failed to use reasonable care when he took a group of tourists diving for sharks without using cages. "Is the thing that killed him something that you normally associate with shark watching?" Lidsky asks, "Or, is it something that could have been avoided had the company used reasonable care?"

This was a quote from a lawyer on the article. It is how lawyers think about the incident (dive death).

Shawn

 

[k-valve]

In the case of Groh, (australian diver who died in Bahama shark dive) the question is whether the tour operator failed to use reasonable care when he took a group of tourists diving for sharks without using cages. "Is the thing that killed him something that you normally associate with shark watching?" Lidsky asks, "Or, is it something that could have been avoided had the company used reasonable care?"

This was a quote from a lawyer on the article. It is how lawyers think about the incident (dive death).

Shawn

Baiting sharks is not very enviro-friendly, nor does it show a lot of common sense on a diver's part if s/he aren't experienced and have the proper protection. I think Teknadv3x and texdiveguy said it best:

I agree with Texdiveguy 100% :we all should respect and obey the rules enforced by the dive operators (parks//boats).....**never dive beyond ones skill/experience/training/gear.....use common sense

 

[Teknadv3x]

K valve
If my memory serves me correctly your a school principle. Here is a scenario that should hit home. A school teacher loses their cool and hits a student for whatever reason. Now a lawsuit is filed against the school district. Do you think it is fair that the taxpayers in that school district be held financially liable for what that teacher did.
Granted the teacher should be punished for their action if found guilty. But making the homeowner/taxpayer on Elm street pay the court settlement for what teacher did is insane. That is what I am talking about: accountably for ones action. NOT everyone accountable for the the ones action.

 

[scubadale]

What if the teacher hit (paddled) the student to hold the student accountable for his actions??

 

[Teknadv3x]

What if the teacher hit (paddled) the student to hold the student accountable for his actions??

the courts can decide if the the teacher was right or wrong.. If they find the teacher was wrong than the teacher should be the only one penalized not the taxpayers.

 

[scubashawn123]

So what do think about needing a dive flag/dive float to keep boats away from the diver. This is a basic rule of diving to display the dive flag/float when diving in most locations.

Most boaters are not educated enough to stay away. A lot of times boaters inveriably come closer to see the dive flag/float. Thus defeating the purpose of the float or flag.

I use my freedom of choice to dive without the float, but with my boat I use a dive flag.

However, technically if I don't use a float in a lot of waters I am breaking the rules (law). Most places require a dive float or flag when diving.

Just another part of the solo diving thread. Who, and how many rules do we really need to tell us how to dive. How many rules do we need to protect us from us. I do use common sense. (we now have in Round Rock the trash police - homeowners get a fine for leaving your garbage can on the street anytime outside a 24 hour window - my neighbor got a ticket last week for putting his trash out 2 hours early the day before - ticket given by Sheriff not a homeowners issue)

I remember last year diving Windy Point and we were yelling at the boaters inside the buoys where divers were located. Those boaters had clearly marked bouys and did not pay attention. Those bouys to me are useless.

When I hear a boat I go low, look up and try and figure out how close the boat is. I hope I have enough water overhead and air to outlast the boat engine noise underwater.

When diving outside the US, dive boats come right up in the water on the first divers surfacing. Not paying attention to the divers still below. Interesting difference.

Just my personal opinion and I hope to keep the lawmakers from regulating our sport of scuba diving. We police ourselves through education and training. I am glad to be a diver.

Shawn O.