Deep Diving on Air

[PfcAJ]

If someone advocated cave diving in an unsafe manner (not running line, diving past thirds, etc), people would be all over it.

Cave diving does not equal deep air. Cave diving without following the guidelines (Shecks' 5, at least) is similar in spirit to deep air. There's a way to dive deep without being blitzed... just like theres a way to cave dive without exposing yourself to unneeded risk.

Cave diving and deep diving are both risky activities, why make it more risky?

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

... And with regards to risk assessment, I think the insurance companies would disagree with you. Getting life insurance as a someone who dives caves is easily doable. Getting life insurance as someone who dives deeper than "recreational" limits, not so much...

I would need to see some proof before I would believe that you are not just making stuff up here, as is popular among the arguments against deeper than 30 m air diving.

My Suunto dive computer allows me to "plan" no-deco dives to 150' deep. Because of some European Regulation, it apparently "has to" operate as a dive computer to 90 m deep.

Please list the life insurance companies who ask if one dives deeper than "recreational" limits, and if you do list any, what are those "published" limits?

 

[DCBC]

Cave diving and deep diving are both risky activities, why make it more risky?

There are diving locations where helium just isn't available. Using your argument, one might suggest why go into a cave at all? isn't it safer outside? You, like me might respond, because I enjoy the experience. Perhaps for some, the added complexity is part of the pleasure.

Personally, I use Helium if it's available (it's often provided free of charge). However, if I want to dive a wreck and Helium isn't available, I may plan on doing it on-air. It depends on the depth, the currents and the dive plan. I always dive within my personal safety envelope and the dive plan must meet a level of safety that I'm personally satisfied with. I suppose that's my point, we should each use our experience and best judgment on every dive. What is acceptable for one, may not fit anothers envelope.

 

[Adobo]

I would need to see some proof before I would believe that you are not just making stuff up here, as is popular among the arguments against deeper than 30 m air diving.

My Suunto dive computer allows me to "plan" no-deco dives to 150' deep. Because of some European Regulation, it apparently "has to" operate as a dive computer to 90 m deep.

Please list the life insurance companies who ask if one dives deeper than "recreational" limits, and if you do list any, what are those "published" limits?

It's been a couple of years since I filled out the questionnaire. I believe the questions were along the lines of, do you scuba dive? If so, do you exceed the industry standard recreational depth limits?

I found the question to be phrased in an odd way since it did not cover "overhead" environments.

Feel free to go dig around for actuarial tables yourself.

At the time, I had a cave cert but no tech cert. Still got the insurance though.

 

[Hank49]

Please list the life insurance companies who ask if one dives deeper than "recreational" limits, and if you do list any, what are those "published" limits?

I applied for Sun Life...I think that was the company....about 13 years ago. They asked if I scuba dived and I said yes. The asked for my cert level and I said open water instructor. The agent said, "oh, okay, it doesn't matter then", meaning that I was "safe". He didn't ask how deep I was diving then....thank goodness.

 

[Centrals]

There are diving locations where helium just isn't available. Using your argument, one might suggest why go into a cave at all? isn't it safer outside? You, like me might respond, because I enjoy the experience. Perhaps for some, the added complexity is part of the pleasure.

Personally, I use Helium if it's available (it's often provided free of charge). However, if I want to dive a wreck and Helium isn't available, I may plan on doing it on-air. It depends on the depth, the currents and the dive plan. I always dive within my personal safety envelope and the dive plan must meet a level of safety that I'm personally satisfied with. I suppose that's my point, we should each use our experience and best judgment on every dive. What is acceptable for one, may not fit anothers envelope.

There are places that even Nitrox is not available let alone He!!!
If I believe there is always better gas than AIR perhaps I should watch TV instead!!!
Have been labelled as "stroke" because I do not copy certain rigging protocol!!!!

 

[VooDooGasMan]

Air Rules, it is available every where you can dive so Deep air diving will always King Of The Road.

As far as comparing I think the ones against need to not just pull there head out of there asses but completely out of there ass and take in a deep breathe of air.

There are numerous dive deaths in OW training where the instructors have students dying, cave divers have a high death rate and the buddy and team diving has there's.

Rebreather divers die often.

This summer a doc from oak harbor here on my Island died in a team diving incident, I could really care less when it say's heart attack, the team diving did not work and the diver died.

We had a few Deep air divers that died or bent and a bit messed up HELLO HELLO HELLO at least deep air divers do live and have a chance to rehabilitate.

Tech diver here many years ago was deep on helium and had the new weezle undergarment on and it clogged the vent on dry suit, He waved to his bride to be that week BYE BYE!! and flew to the surface I was at boat launch in mukilteo and a diver came in and said he needs to get to chamber right now and waited for emergency ride, made it to chamber then died. This guy had a good rep on tech diving teaching, Garret Weinberg died from diving helium and no chamber close enough that day.

I sold my rebreather and did less helium dives cause of it.

Trimix Kills You now, Air you have more of a chance to be alive HELLO ANYBODY OUT THERE thats the way it is.

Deep Air Diving is actually safer to dive then the ones I mentioned above. There is a safer way to try not become a victim of all those kinds of dives, but Diving on air is safer then any other kind of diving.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

“Mother Nature provided the planet Earth with a Nitrox atmosphere known as air. She never said air was the best medium for divers. Here, as in many fields of endeavor, human beings have used their knowledge of natural laws to go one step beyond what Nature has provided.”

- Dr. J. Morgan Wells

 

[DevonDiver]

Please list the life insurance companies who ask if one dives deeper than "recreational" limits, and if you do list any, what are those "published" limits?

I can't remember the name of the insurance company (possibly it wasn't published), but a few years ago there was a string of reports in the UK dive magazines regarding the plight of a female UK diver who got bent on a dive in Cyprus. She was AOW, but had exceeded 30m/100' slightly on the dive preceeding her DCI hit. The insurance company didnt pay out, on grounds that she exceeded her qualification. The dive magazine was organising donations etc, to contribute towards her chamber/medical fees. She also had to sell/re-mortgage her house etc. It was a pretty shocking story.

 

[RTee]

I can't remember the name of the insurance company (possibly it wasn't published), but a few years ago there was a string of reports in the UK dive magazines regarding the plight of a female UK diver who got bent on a dive in Cyprus. She was AOW, but had exceeded 30m/100' slightly on the dive preceeding her DCI hit. The insurance company didnt pay out, on grounds that she exceeded her qualification. The dive magazine was organising donations etc, to contribute towards her chamber/medical fees. She also had to sell/re-mortgage her house etc. It was a pretty shocking story.

Devon...I think she would have got similar result if she had only been OW certified and the insurance company would have learned that she had busted her 60 ft limit by a mere few feet on her preceeding dive. One of my friend was interested in getting his Deep specialty just for that reason...ie so that the insurance company could not refuse payment because he went three curlies below 100 ft.