Deep Diving on Air

[DevonDiver]

I agree. So who do you think is deaf?

I don't think there is a fine-line between ignorance and acceptance of risk - it's a huge chasm.

On a case-by-case basis, my opinions would be determined by the rationale, justification and explanation given by the individual diver for their dive/s.

If we had this debate within a more private forum area, or over a beer in a bar, then I'd engage more fully in the technical aspects of the discussion. But when the debate is conducted in a public area, open to the eyes (and misinterpretation) of inexperienced divers, I feel an ethical obligation not to make comments that might encourage, or otherwise sanction, potentially high risk dives.

 

[VooDooGasMan]

Devon start an Air Diving forum, does not have to say Deep Air Diving.

 

[Adobo]

Air Rules, it is available every where you can dive so Deep air diving will always King Of The Road.

As far as comparing I think the ones against need to not just pull there head out of there asses but completely out of there ass and take in a deep breathe of air.

There are numerous dive deaths in OW training where the instructors have students dying, cave divers have a high death rate and the buddy and team diving has there's.

Rebreather divers die often.

This summer a doc from oak harbor here on my Island died in a team diving incident, I could really care less when it say's heart attack, the team diving did not work and the diver died.

We had a few Deep air divers that died or bent and a bit messed up HELLO HELLO HELLO at least deep air divers do live and have a chance to rehabilitate.

Tech diver here many years ago was deep on helium and had the new weezle undergarment on and it clogged the vent on dry suit, He waved to his bride to be that week BYE BYE!! and flew to the surface I was at boat launch in mukilteo and a diver came in and said he needs to get to chamber right now and waited for emergency ride, made it to chamber then died. This guy had a good rep on tech diving teaching, Garret Weinberg died from diving helium and no chamber close enough that day.

I sold my rebreather and did less helium dives cause of it.

Trimix Kills You now, Air you have more of a chance to be alive HELLO ANYBODY OUT THERE thats the way it is.

Deep Air Diving is actually safer to dive then the ones I mentioned above. There is a safer way to try not become a victim of all those kinds of dives, but Diving on air is safer then any other kind of diving.

For all you other deep air proponents, if you could, please help me understand what points VDGM is trying to convey. Because for the life of me, I cannot find a single thing in the quoted post that I could recognize as a rational thought.

 

[Adobo]

Devon...I think she would have got similar result if she had only been OW certified and the insurance company would have learned that she had busted her 60 ft limit by a mere few feet on her preceeding dive. One of my friend was interested in getting his Deep specialty just for that reason...ie so that the insurance company could not refuse payment because he went three curlies below 100 ft.

There is the "exceeding your training" issue and there is the "lying on your questionnaire" issue. If you do either, the insurance company seems to have an excuse not to pay out in the event that you or your loved ones are filing a claim.

 

[VooDooGasMan]

Adobo If you do not understand that anytime you go underwater your gonna die, then I guarantee you will die underwater soonly and when you take your last breath, remember this post and then you will understand what a rational thought is.

 

[DevonDiver]

Devon start an Air Diving forum, does not have to say Deep Air Diving.

I don't see the need. We have recreational diving and we have technical diving. Just pick an appropriate area, based upon the nature of the dive. The scuba industry has a pretty common definition of technical diving; whilst the wording may change from agency to agency, the basic nature of the division is quite comparable.

Air diving isn't an activity, in itself. It's just one choice of gas to be used in another specific activity.

There is the "exceeding your training" issue and there is the "lying on your questionnaire" issue. If you do either, the insurance company seems to have an excuse not to pay out in the event that you or your loved ones are filing a claim.

That may be true, but there'd be a bunch of references that could be cited to show that 18m/60' isn't ​necessarily exceeding your training at OW level.

Specifically, the fact that PADI state the recommended limit of 18m/60' for "newly certified Open Water divers". Thus, a log book and/or certification date could be used to illustrate that the diver concerned was not "newly certified".

 

[Adobo]

Adobo If you do not understand that anytime you go underwater your gonna die, then I guarantee you will die underwater soonly and when you take your last breath, remember this post and then you will understand what a rational thought is.

I understand that not everybody has English as their native language. I also suspect that you speak English as a second language better than I speak any other language as a second language.

For that reason, I give you the benefit of the doubt that the reason many of your posts make absolutely no bloody sense has to do with a language barrier rather than you being off your rocker.

 

[VooDooGasMan]

Alright devon I can run with that, just need to move threads to the appropriate areas.

 

[Simon-]

There was a question on what insurance companies stipulate a depth limit. This is from the DAN Europe web-site

Depth Limits

Compressed Air and Nitrox. 40 meter max (only for DAN Sport Bronze).

Recreational Diving

Recreational Diving means all snorkelling, and recreational Diving Activities carried out by the Insured as stated in the Schedule or Certificate attached to this Policy with or without breathing apparatus whether as a student or not including:
• Compressed air diving in any form
• Enriched air “nitrox” diving with fixed percentages with an open circuit or a “rebreather”
• The use of oxygen enriched air or of oxygen to maximize decompression safety
• The use of normoxic “Trimix” mixtures at depths less than 50m to minimize the narcotic effects of compressed air.

DAN Europe recommends gas partial pressures up to a maximum of 1,6ATA Oxygen and 5,6ATA Nitrogen in the breathing mixture.



Technical Diving

Technical Diving means dives conducted with the use of variable gas mixtures (Nitrogen-Helium-Oxygen otherwise called Trimix or Helium – Oxygen otherwise called Heliox) up to depths not exceeding 130 metres and/or gas partial pressures of 1,4 ATA Oxygen or up to a maximum of 1,6ATA Oxygen and 3,95ATA Nitrogen in the breathing mixture, and provided that any other relevant local laws and regulations are respected. On written submission of a full dive profile and proposed safety and support measures insurers may consider providing specific per dive insurance for any dive exceeding 130 metres.

 

[Tigerman]

but[/I] there'd be a bunch of references that could be cited to show that 18m/60' isn't ​necessarily exceeding your training at OW level.

Specifically, the fact that PADI state the recommended limit of 18m/60' for "newly certified Open Water divers". Thus, a log book and/or certification date could be used to illustrate that the diver concerned was not "newly certified".
...

Padi does however state 40m as absolute max for recreational diving, atleast in the books I have (Norwegian).
Also my travel insurance specify that it cover recreational diving to a depth no deeper than 30m, so wether or not I try make the claim that 30m is "just recommended max" for my AOW card, Ill be up **** creek without a paddle.. or a canoe.