Casino Point - Avalon, Diver Death 9/5/11

[DandyDon]

Yeah, I think I referenced 32# as heavily weighted earlier in this thread, but I would not call it over weighted. I think the S80 is an aluminum tank alright. I'd be in a 7 mil jumpsuit or farmerjohn for that dive I am sure with 28# myself, 30 or 32 for my male home bud. I can easily imagine a woman needing that much in a heavy suit & saltwater.

 

[drbill]

The issue of whether the deceased diver was over weighted remains to be determined. We do not know her weight, nor are we 100% certain of the weight (lead) she carried unless someone has that specific information direct from a reliable source.

The general guideline here for diving a 7mm wetsuit in our waters is 10% of body weight plus 5-7 lbs. I carry 36 lbs on my belt, which is definitely overweighted to maintain stability when filming on the bottom. When I weighed 270 lbs (last April) it was close to a reasonable weight. Fortunately I've shed a good portion of that unnecessary bioprene over the summer. I've heard the woman was between 120 and 160 lbs, but have no idea if that's even close. If so, the guideline would yield weighting with 17 to 23 lbs.

 

[Mossman]

Good Samaritan Laws protect LAYMEN, not professionals. I don't know what you do, but this is something that all professionals should keep in mind.

Actually good samaritan laws protect professionals and only sometimes laymen depending on the jurisdiction. However, they certainly don't apply in the case of a off-work dive professional being a good samaritan by escorting new divers around the park. Where they would apply in this sort of situation is if there were a accident and an off-work (professional) doctor or nurse were nearby and rendered immediate assistance.

California Health & Safety Code section 1799.102 states:

"(a) No person who in good faith, and not for
compensation, renders emergency medical or nonmedical care at the
scene of an emergency shall be liable for any civil damages resulting
from any act or omission. The scene of an emergency shall not
include emergency departments and other places where medical care is
usually offered. This subdivision applies only to the medical, law
enforcement, and emergency personnel specified in this chapter."

Laymen are also protected to the extent they don't commit gross negligence or worse:

"(b) (1) It is the intent of the Legislature to encourage other
individuals to volunteer, without compensation, to assist others in
need during an emergency, while ensuring that those volunteers who
provide care or assistance act responsibly.
(2) Except for those persons specified in subdivision (a), no
person who in good faith, and not for compensation, renders emergency
medical or nonmedical care or assistance at the scene of an
emergency shall be liable for civil damages resulting from any act or
omission other than an act or omission constituting gross negligence
or willful or wanton misconduct. The scene of an emergency shall not
include emergency departments and other places where medical care is
usually offered. This subdivision shall not be construed to alter
existing protections from liability for licensed medical or other
personnel specified in subdivision (a) or any other law."

 

[timbalcomb]

Even if you are self insured as a DM it is extremely important to have any potential buddies (especially ones you have never met) sign a liability release and a safe-diving practices waiver. Your insurance may do little good if the required paperwork is not completed before the dive. I would encourage anyone who wants to help out newly certified divers like has been discussed above carry blank waivers with them to be filled out before you take them on a dive.

 

[Mossman]

Even if you are self insured as a DM it is extremely important to have any potential buddies (especially ones you have never met) sign a liability release and a safe-diving practices waiver. Your insurance may do little good if the required paperwork is not completed before the dive. I would encourage anyone who wants to help out newly certified divers like has been discussed above carry blank waivers with them to be filled out before you take them on a dive.

I'd encourage them to carry a tip jar too. It can't hurt!

 

[merxlin]

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In line with the special forum rules that apply to this discussion, several posts have now been moved into the Passings forum. These posts can now be found at this location: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/passings/395485-casino-point-dive-accident-9-5-11-a.html

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[Ayisha]

Both divers were using rented S80s from CDS.

If it's correct that the victim was wearing 32 lbs with a steel 80, that sounds extremely overweighted.

I thought the same thing. 32lbs was too much weight for her size...

I think the S80 is actually an aluminum tank.

I think the S80 is an aluminum tank alright.

I thought the poster was using S80 to refer to steel, since we usually see aluminum tanks referred to as AL 80, for example.

If she was using steel, I maintain that it sounds like a lot of weight, but as I said, I do not know her size or configuration. If she was using aluminum, that would be closer in salt water. So does anyone know for certain?

 

[Teamcasa]

Having dived the park on hundreds of occasions and ending up guiding more than one new diver and plenty of experienced divers back to the steps, I can see how easy it would be to end up deeper and out further that you'd expect. The fact is most new divers are over-weighted but I doubt it was the cause but more like an added complication.

I have zero real information on this case (other than what I have read here) but I've seen first hand many new divers deep, lost and a long way from shore. A mixture of confusion, narcosis and a dash of panic and tragedy is a real possibility.
If you are new, trying the park out for the first or second time, ask for help, many of us will gladly let you join us. At the very least, stay close to the kelp.

 

[Ken Kurtis]

I thought the poster was using S80 to refer to steel, since we usually see aluminum tanks referred to as AL 80

If you look on thje actual stamped markings on many aluminum 80s, you'll see "S80" at the end of one of the lines. I'm guessing that's where the reference comes from. The "S" does not mean it's steeel. According to the Catalina Cylinders website (Crown Markings of a SCUBA Cylinder) the "S" stands for "scuba" and the number following it (80 in this instance) refers to tank capacity when full.

And I would agree (and encourage) that in the future using "AL" for aluminum and "ST" would hopefully keep things clearer.

- Ken

 

[cheri&bill]

I don't know if I am glad that I saw this thread or not. I do want to say how sorry I am to Jade and the diver's family. I only have two dives after my Certification and I am diving with my 6'4 husband. I am 5'3 and 130 wet. This tragic event has made me realize there is no way I could possibly be of assistance to him in an emergency where he needed assistance and was panicking (sic). I have even told him that in jest. It isn't a joke now and I know we need to dive with more experienced divers for many more dives before setting off on our own again. So although I am deeply moved and distressed by this terrible loss, I want to thank you for your strength and humility to use her death as a way of saving others. I will definitely have her and you in my prayers tonight! God bless you and give you peace. Bill and Cheri