BP/W BCD-I am puzzled

[SangP]

Yes I want this instructor to be my tech instructor. Infact I like him. He knows that I am on a budget and really helps me about payments and makes discounts for me. He sometimes gives me the equipment I need and do not want any money. I pay him when I want. So it's based on trust. You are right that I need a good relationship. So do you think that I must not order from internet and buy the equipment I want through him? Hmmm I think that you are absolutely right. When he sees that BP/W purchased from another source, he wont feel nice. I will think about that, thank you.

If you really like him then by all means support him but if you're buying from him to keep him nice, then something's wrong.

When I first read your initial post I was surprised that you were told a bp/w cannot be used for single tank and doubles. I'm even more surprised that he's saying you're going to have problems on the surface n balance with a single's setup. Something doesn't add up.

It may be difficult at first but once you get your weighing right, it becomes almost an extension of you. Unless you over inflate the wing on the surface you are not going to fall face first, inflate it enough till you are comfortably above the water n stop.

I have nothing against OMS but there are cheaper n better equipment out there.

Your call,

SangP

 

[TSandM]

Back inflate BCs can push you forward, if you inflate the bladder completely and the BC rides up on your back at all. A properly adjusted backplate and harness, however, has a crotch strap that keeps the bladder down on your back. Because I like my face out of the water, I regularly inflate my wing (both on singles and doubles) until the OPV pops. I have never had my face pushed into the water -- in fact, it's extremely easy to lean back and rest.

I'm with the rest of the crew. The more you tell us about what this "tech instructor" is saying to you, the more worried I become about whether he really knows very much.

 

[impulse]

Well, I am really not sure about his level of knowladge in terms of equipment. Maybe he knows alot maybe not. Maybe he has some kind of financial benefit if I buy a rec BCD or maybe he has not. He is really hard to decode.

I am not sure but If he did not know about technical diving, he would not be able to dive 420 fsw and end the dive without any decompression sickness. I watched his dive on the television so he could not be lying.

So I think he has knowladge about a tech diving but trys to manuplate me buying a conventional rec bcd to aquire more money from me. I am puzzled here. I will talk about this further with him.

 

[dbulmer]

Impulse,

A good technical instructor should know about equipment - I suspect that your instructor does not carry the equipment that you want in his shop. Ask the instructor if he could order the equipment for you and show you how to set it up.

If he's unwilling to do that for you, then change your instructor. A tech instructor can setup a BP/W in minutes and this should be very easy. If the instructor is not willing to help you then I would question his value as an instructor. The good instructors both recreational and technical want their students to remain as students partly because it makes good business sense but also because they enjoy teaching and want to see their student progress.



The advice you've been given here on Scubaboard is correct

 

[dbulmer]

And one other point - the instructor is a human being - he eats, drinks, sleeps and farts like everyone else .. at least when he's not in the water.

 

[Blue982]

Just so we have it all in one place I made this glossary.

Camband: The strap(s) that wrap around a single tank to attach it to any style of BC. They can be used with or without a STA and with or without a wobble stopper (notable exception is some newer Halcyon wings, which require a STA). These come with delrin (plastic) or stainless steel buckles.

STA aka Single Tank Adapter: A device that stabilizes a single diving cylinder on a backplate and wing (BP/W) style buoyancy compensator (BC or BCD). The STA is bolted to the backplate and cambands loop through it and around a tank. Not a required item, but nice to have. Some have lead integrated into it so that you don't have to wear quite so much on a belt.

Wing: The air bag in a BP/W system that allows you to control buoyancy.

Wobble-stopper: A style of single tank adapter (STA) that is integrated into the wing of some BP/W. Usually very low profile. I know DSS and HOG wings include these but I don't know about other manufacturers. Note in the image the wobble stopper is outlined in red, as it is difficult to see.

Tank Bands: Stainless steel bands that connect a pair of tanks together when wearing two on your back. These bands bolt directly to the backplate (similar to how a STA attaches one tank) and eliminate the need for cambands. Also see: tank bands assembled.


Thanks to Precision Diving for some images.

 

[impulse]

Just so we have it all in one place I made this glossary.

Camband: The strap(s) that wrap around a single tank to attach it to any style of BC. They can be used with or without a STA and with or without a wobble stopper (notable exception is Halcyon wings, which require a STA). These come with delrin (plastic) or stainless steel buckles.

STA aka Single Tank Adapter: A device that stabilizes a single diving cylinder on a backplate and wing (BP/W) style buoyancy compensator (BC or BCD). The STA is bolted to the backplate and cambands loop through it and around a tank. Not a required item, but nice to have. Some have lead integrated into it so that you don't have to wear quite so much on a belt.

Wing: The air bag in a BP/W system that allows you to control buoyancy.

Wobble-stopper: A style of single tank adapter (STA) that is integrated into the wing of some BP/W. Usually very low profile. I know DSS and HOG wings include these but I don't know about other manufacturers. Note in the image the wobble stopper is outlined in red, as it is difficult to see.

Tank Bands: Stainless steel bands that connect a pair of tanks together when wearing two on your back. These bands bolt directly to the backplate (similar to how a STA attaches one tank) and eliminate the need for cambands. Also see: tank bands assembled.


Thanks to Precision Diving for some images.

That's great. Thank you very much. I was still unsure what a wobble-stopper is but that image of it cleared all the questions.

Tank bands were the parts I saw on his doubles. He showed me that when I wanted to buy a BP/W for the singles and told me about the bolts. I now start to better understand how elusive how he acts and now after those images, his statements started to make no-sense at all. I think he is not trying to really help me about this BP/W thing. Thanks for teaching me those stuff. You guys here really illuminated me about the subject better than the so-called techical instructor. This is really weird.

By the way, I talked to my instructor again about attaching the tank to a BP/W type BCD and he said, that types of attachement do not stabilize the tank well enough that it still moves from one side to the other.

I am sure that you will say, noo your instructor is wrong. I feel pathetic abou my technical diving future... :S

Maybe I must go Dahab and take my tek diving class there..Hehe..

 

[fisheater]

There's a VERY impressive video on the Deep Sea Supply site showing how stable a tank is with their "wobble stoppers."

Check it out.

 

[TSandM]

I use DSS wings with wobble-stoppers, and the tank does not move. I have dived everything from Aluminum 80s (I think you call them 12Ls) to steel 130s, which are big, heavy tanks. An STA is, if anything, even more secure. Your instructor has clearly never used a BP/W single tank setup.

 

[Guy Alcala]

Just so we have it all in one place I made this glossary.

Camband: The strap(s) that wrap around a single tank to attach it to any style of BC. They can be used with or without a STA and with or without a wobble stopper (notable exception is Halcyon wings, which require a STA). These come with delrin (plastic) or stainless steel buckles.

I guess that's true for the Eclipse wings but not for the older Pioneers, as I've been using my Pioneer 36 (bought used) for 2+ years with just the cambands. I hadn't noticed that the Eclipse didn't have camband slots. It may be that my tank wobbles a bit and I'm unaware of it, but it's never been an issue. Maybe I just don't know what I'm missing, but for me the STA would be primarily a convenience issue, if I was regularly switching back and forth between singles and doubles using the same plate.

Guy