A request to the "new" DIR advocates

[rcohn]

rec.scuba was once the best scuba site on the internet, several very knowledgeable posters, and the best discussions and info. Quite a few jerks too and arguments to be accurate. For example, DIR was thoroughly discussed for years before anyone heard of it on Rodale’s. I used to read the site religiously.

Now the site has turned into a complete waste of time. Most of the knowledgeable people have gone (some are here and on Rodale’s occasionally) and the site seems to be just endless, pointless, vicious, boring arguments over nothing. I haven’t looked at it in roughly a year.

Ralph

 

[Jeblis]

Ok upon rereading my post I semed a little too definite about there being better methods in commercial/military diving. I do know that they do things differently and I think we would be remis if we didn't question why.

A few examples follows. While I admit many of these aren't "fun" or cheap, I'm really only focusing on safety.



FFMasks allow verbal communication. It is my belief that many accidents in diving could be prevented with the efficiency of verbal communication. Hand signals and touching are good, but verbal would be the best.

Surface support teams
Surface supplied air
Surface mixing control
Backup suited divers

Comments?

 

[Raven C]

It's not DIR or DIR Fund. or DIR practices or DIR Training that makes people act rude, mean, arrogant, etc - like they do. It's people that are that way anyway.

In the beginning it was easy for me to discard DIR because of some of the rants and spouts that I heard/read. However, in my quest for learning and knowledge and the desire to dive better I found that DIR teaches some very good, very practical, very safe and very reasonable methods that I personally wanted to incorporate into my diving skills.

DIR does not teach be a jerk, be mean or rude, or point out that you are right when everyone else is wrong. It happens to be people that do this. George I. has a very brass and abrasive method of presenting most everything but that is George. That is his personality. That is not DIR. People who think that his personality is all that DIR is, is wrong and they would benefit from looking further to learn or just look the other way. There isn't any training for diving that teaches, be mean to others, or at least I haven't found it. If I am wrong I am sure someone will correct me in that.

People need to remember what they love about diving. I am positive that it doesn't include fighting with others.

The plea of this thread is - do not speak on behalf of those who have adopted DIR skills and methods as part of their diving preference as a representation of those as a whole who have. It is also important to remember that those who give a "group" a bad name by their actions is not the only culpret. Those who accept a few to represent a mass without validation from the mass are pretty much to blame as well.

Don't judge all those who dive DIR by are few good or bad.
Don't judge all those who dive rec by a few good or bad.
Don't judge all those who...by a few good or bad.

If you feel you must judge, do so only on the individual basis and if you can, don't judge.

Take the information, process it, file it appropriately and don't apply it to anyone or anything where it really doesn't apply. All those from Iraq are not like Saddam. So don't threat them like they are. Recognize those who act like Saddam are wannabe's without the "right" to be. Those who try to take on George's "arrogance" do not have the accomplishments that he has causes him to feel like he has the right to act that way -right or wrong.

Remember, one bad apple spoils the whole bunch is an anology to fruit. One bad person doesn't make everyone in that group bad, it makes that person stand out as bad.

Dive safe and have fun. R

 

[Zagnut]

Wow! Just got back from Rec.scuba. Makes this place seem like the Library of Congress.

It always amazes me. We can come up with some of the most awesome and impressive technology...and that is what we do with it?... :notme:

 

[MHK]

Jeblis once bubbled...
Ok upon rereading my post I semed a little too definite about there being better methods in commercial/military diving. I do know that they do things differently and I think we would be remis if we didn't question why.

A few examples follows. While I admit many of these aren't "fun" or cheap, I'm really only focusing on safety.



FFMasks allow verbal communication. It is my belief that many accidents in diving could be prevented with the efficiency of verbal communication. Hand signals and touching are good, but verbal would be the best.

Surface support teams
Surface supplied air
Surface mixing control
Backup suited divers

Comments?

In no small part am I trying to minimize your focus on saftey, however the need to balance practicality and efficiency is a difficult balance. While for sure we would all want Chamber's overhead, tender's ready to go and so on, the commercial and military luxuries simply aren't practical in real world diving.

Also, as you suggest FFM's provide verbal communication, however cost notwithstanding, they provide there own set of concerns such as dead air space and C02 buildup's. The tradeoff would need to be considered juxtaposed against the fact that many diver's dive overweighted, work hard, may struggle against a current and so forth.. C02 is 130 times more narcotic then N2, so while they may provide verbal communication there is a host of other considerations to consider..

Surface supplied gas works in certain environments, but don't work on other's such as kelp, and can cause entanglements in OE's so again the balance between what a commercial diver does ie; has a fixed mission -v- a recreational diver roaming a kelp reef is vastly different. The idea behind DIR is to bring the tools needed for the job and nothing else, and in my view some of what you suggest while perhaps adding to a safety margin, simply isn't practical..

Regards

 

[MikeFerrara]

Zagnut once bubbled...
Wow! Just got back from Rec.scuba. Makes this place seem like the Library of Congress.

It always amazes me. We can come up with some of the most awesome and impressive technology...and that is what we do with it?... :notme:

It's interesting stuff all right. From what I read over there apparantly the SB people were afraid to introduce themeselve to the Popeye/airhog (mickey smith) crowd. They said that was smart of them. Did they make them stay on their own side of the quarry or what?

All these years diving and I had no idea that I was bringing my family around such people.

 

[pt40fathoms]

I believe the Latin word for them is "rectumus maximus". (note; not a real Latin word, but it sounds appropriate)

It does not matter if I am diving, flying, golfing or skydiving. In every group, once it reaches a large enough size, the rectumus maximus will appear. They can be easily spotted, but most often are heard first. Bombastic in their self proclamation of heightened skills and abilities. They often find it necessary to find fault in others in order to enhance their own status. This fault they perceive in others, is in most cases, merely pointing out that others do not act and think as they do. Often they will be accompanied by a small following of supporters. These supporters, as with the recumus maximus, tend to be avoided by all others who find themselves engaged in the same activity. They are often the topic of conversation, always in a negative light.

The method of dealing with the recumus maximus is simple. Avoid contact, educate others as to their existence, and strive to be the opposite of what they are.

 

[Laser]

MikeFerrara once bubbled...


It's interesting stuff all right. From what I read over there apparantly the SB people were afraid to introduce themeselve to the Popeye/airhog (mickey smith) crowd. They said that was smart of them. Did they make them stay on their own side of the quarry or what?

All these years diving and I had no idea that I was bringing my family around such people.

I met Popeye there for the first time and he's one of the nicest guys I've ever met. A knowledgable diver as well.

 

[dad6b]

Jeblis once bubbled...


Surface support teams
Surface supplied air
Surface mixing control
Backup suited divers

Comments?

For your run-of-the-mill weekend recreational dive this would surely be overkill. For more demanding techincal dives, I believe that people do employ support divers.

As for supplied air, if you've ever used any type of supplied air system (even out of the water) you'll understand how much of a pain in the ass it is to drag the hose behind you. Just imagine the spaghetti pile that would result on some of the cattle boats!

Drew A. Dunn

 

[MikeFerrara]

Laser once bubbled...




I met Popeye there for the first time and he's one of the nicest guys I've ever met. A knowledgable diver as well.

Well, I can't contradict you since I've never met him. He and I don't seem to see eye to eye on anything diving related but that doesn't mean he's not a nice guy.