A different take on Master Scuba Diver

[TMHeimer]

Sure, I understand. But the implication of that is that an ‘experienced’ diver should be able to be dropped into any body of water anywhere in the world and cope with it. Rather than courses teaching generic skills that are then tailored to local environments through further training and experience relevant to the diver. If I was from Australia and would only ever dive in the tropics, why would I need to learn to dive in low viz, cold U.K. waters to be considered an experienced diver?

You make a good point. I would guess there is at least the same % of serious incidents in the tropics as in the low-viz North. At least from what I read on SB about "vacation" divers who dive once or twice a year down there. Having dived in both climates my take on it is the rescue skills are basically the same wherever you dive. If you're not familiar with the conditions, the actual diving will be a problem to begin with-- so it's best to take it slowly before you get in a position to rescue someone or to be rescued.

 

[kinoons]

So if a diver doesn’t intend to take further training (beyond, say, RD and the odd specialty); never intends to do deco dives; won’t ever dive in a team (apart from their buddy, and as opposed to a ‘group’ rather than a ‘team’); can learn good trim, propulsion and buoyancy through practice and other training; will never dive in BP&W; and wants to have fun diving in sunny places with lots of fish and turtles… Why do Fundies?

This is me. I’ve been an open water diver for 8 years. I have 40 dives under my belt in those 8 years. 90% of my diving is done in very warm water on relatively shallow reefs. I have no interest in caves, glaciers, or very cold water. Fresh water bores me, not much to look at. I made the mistake of diving Tahoe one time and I’ll never do it again.

I’m likely average to acceptable at maintaining trim. I can kick along and not get tired. My bouyancy isn’t second nature, but I can maintain my depth with minimal effort and little thought. I don’t balloon up or drop like a rock.

Am I an expert or master diver? Nope. Do I aim to be one? Nope. Do I think I am skilled enough for the type of diving I enjoy? Yes.

Can I be your buddy in an emergency? I believe so. My OW instruction was 1:1 and we practiced OOG emergencies several times. I’ve practiced OOG with my local buddy once or twice a year. I’ve never had an event underwater, but I do work in emergency medicine so thinking and acting under pressure generally isn’t an issue. Hopefully I never need to find out. My first exposure to emergency medicine was YMCA lifeguard back in the early 90’s, so I have had some exposure to water rescue.

I’m not against more training if my goals change, but at the moment I’m comfortable with the diver I am.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

I found the PADI Rescue Course reasonably easy physically, but tough mentally. I think these courses vary a lot as per the instructor. The only problem being a RD is that while you can practice the skills after certified, you may never be in a position to do a serious rescue. I've talked to several experienced instructors who have taught many courses and haven't done a real rescue yet. But, all you can do is practice and hope you will respond correctly.

I took an American Red Cross Advanced Lifesaving course in 1988 at the age of 20 while in college. We learned to perform lifeguard rescues without equipment. Every lifeguard course I did after that was completely reliant upon the use of a rescue can or rescue tube. The YMCA and the Red Cross dropped their swimming standards over the years, but I figured the 500-yards in 10 minutes standard I did in 1988 was something to retain throughout my lifeguard and scuba instructor life.

19 years later in 2007 at age 39, I heard a guy yell for help at a beach. I ran from a space on the road about 100 yards down the beach, swam about 150 yards out, then put him in a cross-chest carry and began towing him back. I discovered I was in a rip and adjusted by swimming parallel to shore. When we got into shallow water, he wanted to hang out a while before we got out to save his dignity. He had become exhausted and had put his ego aside to keep from drowning. I told him that was smart. That kicked my butt!!! I was in truly great shape at the time.

Principle of primacy: The things you learn first you retain the longest. Almost 20 years later, that 1 credit physical education class became the most valuable course I took in college.

Having done the real thing on more than one occasion, I'd recommend a minimum fitness standard for USLA lifeguards for lifeguards, and the standards for USCG AST rescue swimmers or US Navy AIRR rescue swimmers for divers.

 

[Zef]

I think you’ve misunderstood what I wrote. NAUI includes dive theory (beyond the OW level) as part of (amateur) MSD. PADI includes it as an optional course for amateur divers, and compulsory for (professional) DMs and above. The main difference is where it sits in the training pipeline. PADI has decided it’s only necessary for professional divers. NAUI hasn’t. Who cares? Recreational divers aren’t dying because they haven’t completed 16 hours and more of dive theory, and if they had to it would probably put a lot off for no good reason.

I don't think I misunderstood what you wrote. I think you only make that distinction because you subscribe to PADI's standards and believe their notion of placing that body of knowledge within their professional curriculum as being the best place for it. Reality is that the dive theory that NAUI teaches begins in their basic open water course and is just reinforced all the way through MSD. While I am a PADI DM, my initial training was NAUI, and I recall much more extensive knowledge of dive science being required in that first course than any PADI curriculum that I have reviewed.

Is dive theory/science required to dive and have fun? no....but as you gain experience and decide to start planning and leading dives it is damned good knowledge to have so you can do so competently and effectively.

Congrats on obtaining your MSD card...I hope you use it an impetus to learn more and expand your diving horizons.

-Z

 

[TMHeimer]

I took an American Red Cross Advanced Lifesaving course in 1988 at the age of 20 while in college. We learned to perform lifeguard rescues without equipment. Every lifeguard course I did after that was completely reliant upon the use of a rescue can or rescue tube. The YMCA and the Red Cross dropped their swimming standards over the years, but I figured the 500-yards in 10 minutes standard I did in 1988 was something to retain throughout my lifeguard and scuba instructor life.

19 years later in 2007 at age 39, I heard a guy yell for help at a beach. I ran from a space on the road about 100 yards down the beach, swam about 150 yards out, then put him in a cross-chest carry and began towing him back. I discovered I was in a rip and adjusted by swimming parallel to shore. When we got into shallow water, he wanted to hang out a while before we got out to save his dignity. He had become exhausted and had put his ego aside to keep from drowning. I told him that was smart. That kicked my butt!!! I was in truly great shape at the time.

Principle of primacy: The things you learn first you retain the longest. Almost 20 years later, that 1 credit physical education class became the most valuable course I took in college.

Having done the real thing on more than one occasion, I'd recommend a minimum fitness standard for USLA lifeguards for lifeguards, and the standards for USCG AST rescue swimmers or US Navy AIRR rescue swimmers for divers.

Makes sense to me. I do review the rescue manual occasionally but almost always dive solo, so rescuing another will probably not happen before I hang up my fins. I wonder at times if many scuba instructors actually practice the rescue techniques just on their own with a buddy. I'll never know. Just like I wonder how many people who "renew" their CPR every 2 years or so actually practice or review anything in between.
So it was 19 years before you used your rescue skills in that situation? I've only been diving 17.

 

[TMHeimer]

This is me. I’ve been an open water diver for 8 years. I have 40 dives under my belt in those 8 years. 90% of my diving is done in very warm water on relatively shallow reefs. I have no interest in caves, glaciers, or very cold water. Fresh water bores me, not much to look at. I made the mistake of diving Tahoe one time and I’ll never do it again.

I’m likely average to acceptable at maintaining trim. I can kick along and not get tired. My bouyancy isn’t second nature, but I can maintain my depth with minimal effort and little thought. I don’t balloon up or drop like a rock.

Am I an expert or master diver? Nope. Do I aim to be one? Nope. Do I think I am skilled enough for the type of diving I enjoy? Yes.

Can I be your buddy in an emergency? I believe so. My OW instruction was 1:1 and we practiced OOG emergencies several times. I’ve practiced OOG with my local buddy once or twice a year. I’ve never had an event underwater, but I do work in emergency medicine so thinking and acting under pressure generally isn’t an issue. Hopefully I never need to find out. My first exposure to emergency medicine was YMCA lifeguard back in the early 90’s, so I have had some exposure to water rescue.

I’m not against more training if my goals change, but at the moment I’m comfortable with the diver I am.

You're probably OK with your buddy. But, there are a few other skills in the Rescue course that I think everyone should at least know. Two that come to mind are what to do with a panicked diver on the surface (or underwater)-- the specific steps/procedures. And how to safely bring an unconscious diver to the surface. These and a number of others such as in-water rescue breaths aren't taught in most agencys' OW courses.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Makes sense to me. I do review the rescue manual occasionally but almost always dive solo, so rescuing another will probably not happen before I hang up my fins. I wonder at times if many scuba instructors actually practice the rescue techniques just on their own with a buddy. I'll never know. Just like I wonder how many people who "renew" their CPR every 2 years or so actually practice or review anything in between.
So it was 19 years before you used your rescue skills in that situation? I've only been diving 17.

I am working on standards for a training agency where rescue skill recertifications will become a requirement. That last sentence made me laugh.

 

[kinoons]

You're probably OK with your buddy. But, there are a few other skills in the Rescue course that I think everyone should at least know. Two that come to mind are what to do with a panicked diver on the surface (or underwater)-- the specific steps/procedures. And how to safely bring an unconscious diver to the surface. These and a number of others such as in-water rescue breaths aren't taught in most agencys' OW courses.

I did some of that some time ago in my early lifeguard career; refreshing those skills, learning how their different with BCDs, regs, etc…wouldn’t be a bad move.

 

[Searcaigh]

This has been a very interesting read, especially with all of the comments over the past 24 hours.

What PADI is missing on the MSD card is the list of dive courses taken to achieve that card, which would provide further information about the diver, plus the MSD card would be probably the only card one would need to carry.

 

[Celt]

That’s quite a high bar! Even for BSAC with their lengthy but comprehensive training programme that would be Advanced Diver, post Dive Leader/Dive Master. That’s several years worth of diving!

But it can be several years of enjoyment. A lot of people do what your doing and give it up after a year or two. Which is fine if its not for them. But some become overwhelmed if its to fast and doesn't go quite like they imagined. Taking a little time to get some diving done with friends where there's no pressure to perform gives you time to slip into your own underwater zone where your happy and comfortable. It's hard to explain but everyone has it.