Cave Training

[DiveLikeAMuppet]

At the risk of diverging from topic (so if you feel like DM is more appropriate, works for me), why are 1on1 classes bad? Is it a “zero to hero” risk thing? Would love to hear your thoughts

I think it's just a quick and easy filter when looking for an instructor as there are far too many technically skilled instructors. Everyone knows it's a bit of a disservice to students to teach 1:1 but only some compromise because rent needs to be paid. Generally the good ones will try to have former students join the class to tag along as a minimum, for the duration of the class.

From what I experienced, diving in a team of two to three trainees lets the instructor become a "cave shadow" (or gremlin...) From day 1, you execute a cave dive with similarly trained divers, the instructor does not intervene in the first part of the dive unless you are about to kill yourself and in the second part can throw scenarios at the team and observe how everyone reacts. Most of the time you don't even see the instructor for the majority of the dive.

You get to try different roles in the team, build additional capacity and hopefully become capable of diving without a guide or instructor.

I've experienced two extreme outcomes. I had a major disagreement with a friend who trained 1:1 and who is a high-performing diver, at least in terms of technical skills. I was on the receiving end of a bit of shouting (both of us were newbies after intro to cave with maybe 10 cave dives each) because I wasn't as good as his former instructor-teammate, haven't dived the cave 100x times and hence didn't have the perfect position relative to the cave/line outside of simulated situations.

I also went diving with another friend who trained 1:1 with someone I would call a lifestyle cave instructor. Since he wasn't high-performing, he completed intro to cave but learned to be fully dependent on the instructor and follow like a puppy. As there was no instructor or guide around on our dive, he fully latched onto me and contributed nothing to the team or dive. Which was scary.

 

[kensuf]

I'm a believer that if you're traveling anyway, do one half in Florida and one half in Mexico. Florida has flow and depth, Mexico has navigation, navigation, navigation.

My general recommendation is to do the first half in Florida, then the second in Mexico. I would also expect to tack on a day or two on the first half just to make sure your sidemount is squared away.

 

[Mobulai]

Lots of good input on having variations on team buddies and having real learning situations in class, also that the instructor can gremlin around and observe team interactions.

I've experienced two extreme outcomes..

As extreme these 2 cases are, they are kinda the edge cases that I was looking for, bit of the impact on building team behavior — beyond the direct “quality” of technique and skills acquired in class; that was something new from what I read/heard before.

Thanks everyone who indulged this sidebar, I know it has been discussed multiple times on the board before

 

[The Chairman]

Florida is far, far more challenging, and so the caves are far more consistent in how they are lined out. If you can dive in Florida, you can dive in Mexico. Hell, you can dive most anywhere. Mexican caves are more decorated and that can be alluring. What's right for you? For me, it's all about your instructor. Get that on straight, and you'll have a great class. IOW, travel to where your instructor of choice teaches. In Florida, I'd go with @Capt Jim Wyatt or @kensuf. If Tulum, I'd go with Nan of DUTJ. There are others, and it's up to you to pick the right one, but these are the instructors that have impressed me the most.

 

[halocline]

Yes he is. I did Sidemount, Intro to Tech, some of AN/DP and Intro with him. He's a fantastic instructor. I've worked with everyone in that shop and they are all world class. I'm going to be working out their shop next month with one of my students who wants to train in warm water, then I'm going to do some cave training with Nat. You can't go wrong spending money there - I'd say in the years I've worked with them, they've 10x'ed my knowledge.

I did full cave and ANDP with Vince; intro, SM, and stage with Nat. And I’ve dove with both of them for years. They are two different personalities but I’ve never met more dedicated teachers in any field. The commitment to high standards and a positive-yet-demanding environment in that shop is remarkable.

For the OP; Mexico is a great option for cave training and OW training. There are all sorts of reasons why, the caves are perfect for training because they’re shallow, low flow, lots of navigation things to learn, really varied in character. And for OW diving Cozumel is an easy day trip from Playa or Puerto Aventuras, a bit more of a trek from Tulum, but easily doable on the same trip. There’s plenty of inexpensive decent options for lodging and food, pretty cheap to get to, and hanging out in Mexico is fun.

 

[InWay2Deep]

If you plan to dive both FL/MX style caves then I suggest you do Intro in FL, get a taste of the flow, use a dry suit, get the basics down then do some Intro level diving in both FL and MX. Then after a dozen or so good cave dives finish up in MX where you can really learn navigation as that's what Full really gets you (other than the use of more gas). I find that the Intro/Full cave class combined is pretty long (as it should be) and I absorb less information the longer a class is. So you can learn the basics, practice them, then refine those skills in your full cave class. Both locations offer something different and you get the added benefit of multiple instructors perspectives on cave diving. You will be more intelligent when asking questions and just a total newB. There are amazing instructors in both locations.

I trained in Missouri, did some cave diving for about a year in MO, FL and MX then finished up MX and don't regret it at all.

 

[oya]

It's very important to come into class with thorough familiarity with a redundant gas setup. I don't care whether it's backmount or sidemount, but comfort with your gear is essential - that way, the student can focus on learning to cave dive, rather than simultaneously learning a new configuration AND how to cave dive.

Agency matters less than instructor, although a lot of cave instructions carry cards from different agencies anyhow. If you planned to go the GUE route, it would be a different matter, but you'll get great training from reputable instructions regardless of agency.

I think there's a lot to be said for getting training and experience in different locales with different conditions. The Floridian caves tend to trend a little deeper and a little cooler with more flow; as a result, your exposure protection and equipment (especially your choice of tanks) will be a little heavier. Instructors will emphasise buoyancy and trim, of course, but they will also pay special attention to helping you work with the flow: namely, how to hide from it and how to read the cave to predict eddies and flows, and thereby work with the cave's layout to minimise your energy expenditure. In Mexico, the caves tend to be much shallower with little to no flow, with delicate decorations and haloclines - I think it makes for a more comprehensive education if students are exposed to such dramatically contrasting conditions.

My wife and I run a cave diver's bed and breakfast located halfway between Tulum and Playa del Carmen in Mexico - you can check us out at www.xoc-ha.com . Let me know if you have any questions.