GUE Fundamentals

[Heat Miser]

I would be taking it; not so much as, for the team, I prefer to solo; but rather to improve my skills, primarily finning and buoyancy control.

Fundies will show you how to improve your buoyancy skills, however the team aspect is very very important. I'm pretty certain solo does not compute in GUE.

When you see GUE divers work together, they all have a standardised set-up, dive the same profile on standard gases, with a common objective, there doesn't appear to be any I in GUE

Even if you are not fully sold on GUE's kool-aid and you have your disagreements, express them as respectful questions in hopes you will get a reasonable examplanation. That worked for me 100% of the time. If not, just be patient on these 4 days and then you can choose by yourself. You are not there to deconvert the GUE instructor or to simply debate the philosophy. If you that's your goal you simply will make everybody angry and waste valuable time. Also the GUE instructors are evaluating you on how accepting you are of the GUE principles. You could be the best diver in the world in the water, and still they might be forced to fail you if you show them repeatedly that you don't value the GUE philosophy. "I think I might start smoking and getting wasted before every dive after GUE-F", "I don't get why people dive in teams. Solo diving is the way. I can't wait to show me how to fix my trim", "Everybody for themselves when **** hits the fan. You are OOA, well you had better check your spg more often", "I dive for 15 years and I know that X is better", are all reasons for an instructor to fail you.

The above is something I probably didn't appreciate until after I had enrolled in fundies, but concur with it wholeheartedly. I only got a provisional and then COVID-19 got in the way, because Australia put up border restrictions between states, but I can say that after the course there was a noticeable change in my gear setup, the way I plan dives, think about gases mixes, calculate turn pressures and generally try and improve my situational awareness on dives.

Fundies is going to improve your diving, in my case I was negatively buoyant and using my hands to do a lot of finning. My RMV (SAC rate) has come down from 24 litres per min to 18 litres per min, and I can get it down to 15 when highly relaxed. That's not 3,000 dive level SAC rate, but I accept that I'm a gas guzzler and now use it to my advantage pushing gas through my loop on my rebreather.

Personally, I wish I had watched the Gue.tv website before hand and practiced some of the drills in a wing. Also it's easier in gear your comfortable with, I rented gear and ended up in a double wing on a single tank setup. Most importantly, make certain you have a set of Jet-Fins (or Jet-Fin like fins). I had a set of TUSA's good for the Maldives not so good for Back-Kicking and Helicopter Turns.

The pace over 4 days is fast and there is not a lot of time to repeat things you don't get straight away.

 

[Lorenzoid]

The point is, fundies is strict in config during the class. Outside the class you're free to do whatever you like, there's no Scuba police.

I believe this has not been emphasized enough in the replies I have read, so I'm quoting you with emphasis.

Even in the course, if you're not aiming for a tech rating, as far as I'm aware you're not required to have lights (canister or other), a backup mask or wetnotes. Now, I see that the standards for the GUE Base Equipment Configuration (Appendix A) do say the base configuration includes a backup mask and wetnotes (but does not mention lights), and the standards also say that the required equipment for Fundies is the "GUE base equipment configuration as outlined in Appendix A." Maybe things have changed since my first Fundies class in 2014, but we students who were not aiming for tech were not required to use a light for signaling or have a backup mask or wetnotes. The standards say that to achieve a recreational rating, the requirement is only to "demonstrate ability to use underwater communication," but for a technical rating a further requirement is to "demonstrate proficiency with a primary light." This leads me to believe that use of a light for signaling is not required of the rec-only diver in Fundies. An instructor might teach it to rec-only students, but I'm not so sure it's required for a rec pass.

But after the course, hey, go ahead and add that extra D-ring or padded shoulder straps or whatever, if you still believe you need it. Nobody cares. In the course, the instructor endeavors to explain why each item in the standard configuration is the way it is, and if you ask a specific question about some item of gear or a procedure you will get a specific answer in which the reasoning becomes clear. I found the answers compelling. For that reason, I suspect many people drop their ideas of extra D-rings and such and continue to use a more or less standard GUE configuration after Fundies. Although I like the idea of using lights for signaling, I do not use a light in daytime in clear, tropical open water. I have seen promotional pictures out there of GUE divers with canister lights in those kinds of conditions, but I suspect there are very few such divers in the real world. My canister light stays home when I go tropical vacation diving with my usual buddy (my wife). That said, if I were to dive with a team in which we all were to agree on the use of a primary light in those conditions, I would be fine with that too. Similarly, I suspect many rec-only divers leave the course not thinking so much about "team" diving as simply being a better buddy. But if a diver finds himself diving with other GUE divers, and certain tasks need to be divvied up, such as who is going to deploy the SMB, who is going to time the safety stops, etc., then the diver is prepared for the idea of acting as a team.

 

[pauldw]

Why do they call it “fundamentals” instead of “fundamentalists”?

 

[rjack321]

Why do they call it “fundamentals” instead of “fundamentalists”?

Because nobody is proselytizing anyone in GUE-F. Not to mention you aren't required to buy anything, or oftentimes even fork over rental fees, most instructors have a everything you need for loan - because instructors want students to get the most that they can out of the course and they don't make anything on gear sales anyway.

But you had to get in a dig didn't you?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Why do they call it “fundamentals” instead of “fundamentalists”?

If you are in Seattle, I'd be happy to loan you a BP/W for either single/double tanks and a canister light if you take fundies. Then you incur zero equipment expense and can go for the skills.

It is aptly named as these are fundamental recreational dive skills: trim, buoyancy control, finning, weighting, controlled ascents/descents, DSMB deployment, ... + team diving (and buddy diving is a fundamental skill as well, though a too often ignored one). Even if you are not interested in team diving afterwards, there is stil the improvement in situational awareness.

GUE has a building block training path. Makes complete sense when you understand the end game. It may or may not be the best way, but it certainly is a good way with a track record. You don't have to adopt their way. I haven't 100% yet I recommend the class every time it comes up (unless BSAC is an option, that's another good one).

I don't know if people think GUE should allow jacket style BCDs, short hoses, split fins, handheld lights, etc. because that's what many/most people dive. I don't even want to think about what chaos a fundies class would be to accomodate that. Fundies is just fine the way it is. Just go for the skills people. Then do whatever you want. I doubt anyone will go back to split fins unless a knee issue warrants it.

 

[drrich2]

Also the GUE instructors are evaluating you on how accepting you are of the GUE principles. You could be the best diver in the world in the water, and still they might be forced to fail you if you show them repeatedly that you don't value the GUE philosophy. "I think I might start smoking and getting wasted before every dive after GUE-F", "I don't get why people dive in teams. Solo diving is the way. I can't wait to show me how to fix my trim", "Everybody for themselves when **** hits the fan. You are OOA, well you had better check your spg more often", "I dive for 15 years and I know that X is better", are all reasons for an instructor to fail you.

I'm pretty certain solo does not compute in GUE.

there doesn't appear to be any I in GUE

It's understandable people overtly expressing intent to engage in grossly unsafe practices in front of the course instructor could be deemed unsuitable. Particularly if part of the agenda of GUE Fundamentals is to prepare a given diver to be a capable and reliable 'GUE diver,' ready for inclusion into a GUE team. Other GUE divers ought to be able to count on this person, in theory.

And I know GUE doesn't teach a course in, or advocate, solo diving. They have a strong emphasis on team diving, understandable considering their backstory.

That said, I'd like to know...is the GUE instructor community known for being hostile to solo diving? Is it some sort of unspoken but commonly known 'no-no' that you don't mention that you do some solo diving (while taking a GUE course)?

Or is it just something they don't teach or endorse, so they ignore it? Anti-solo diving, or it's just not part of their agenda?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

That said, I'd like to know...is the GUE instructor community known for being hostile to solo diving? Is it some sort of unspoken but commonly known 'no-no' that you don't mention that you do some solo diving (while taking a GUE course)?

Or is it just something they don't teach or endorse, so they ignore it? Anti-solo diving, or it's just not part of their agenda?

No hostility towards me. Given that I was a solo diving instructor at the time I took fundies, I'm pretty sure my instructor knew, but it never came up. No reason for it. He was teaching the GUE syllabus. There was no proselytizing against solo diving, just that they don't do it in their system. Makes complete sense.

I think if GUE instructors were doing solo dives, they might have an issue with that, but I can't speak for HQ.

The GUE Seattle community is great. The GUE instructions in the Seattle area are great. There really is no issue. I can't speak for other regions. I suspect based on the bickering that they might be different.

 

[rjack321]

It's understandable people overtly expressing intent to engage in grossly unsafe practices in front of the course instructor could be deemed unsuitable. Particularly if part of the agenda of GUE Fundamentals is to prepare a given diver to be a capable and reliable 'GUE diver,' ready for inclusion into a GUE team. Other GUE divers ought to be able to count on this person, in theory.

And I know GUE doesn't teach a course in, or advocate, solo diving. They have a strong emphasis on team diving, understandable considering their backstory.

That said, I'd like to know...is the GUE instructor community known for being hostile to solo diving? Is it some sort of unspoken but commonly known 'no-no' that you don't mention that you do some solo diving (while taking a GUE course)?

Or is it just something they don't teach or endorse, so they ignore it? Anti-solo diving, or it's just not part of their agenda?

In class? More or less ignore while recommending (at most once) you avoid it. Assuming you bring it up at all as it's not part of their curriculum.

After class? I would suspect a bunch of "cluck clucking" around the GUE shop (if there is one) about your solo diving habits. Which may impact your ability to find buddies there.

 

[mariosx]

I think if GUE instructors were doing solo dives, they might have an issue with that, but I can't speak for HQ.

Well there have been GUE instructors solo diving in the past. If they did not endorse it openly while representing GUE, I don't think that they will be kicked out. Worst case they might have issues progressing, but I have no idea. We need more senior GUE members to answer that question.

There was this horrible event last year, where a new very capable GUE instructor died while solo diving his rebreather due to cardiac arrest I think. Still a taboo in the community.

 

[ginti]

After class? I would suspect a bunch of "cluck clucking" around the GUE shop (if there is one) about your solo diving habits. Which may impact your ability to find buddies there.

Probably it depends on the area... As for me and the bunch of GUE friends I have, we really don't care if a person dives solo or not. I/we care that this person is a reliable buddy when diving with me/us.