Why the Prejudice about DIR or GUE

[MXGratefulDiver]

But for the OW diving that I do, I don't want one.

Then don't use one ... seems simple enough.

A couple of times per year I go somewhere topical and since my wife doesn't dive, I'm stuck with some unknown on the boat. In that situation, a diver bolting to the surface is of great concern to me and I need to know that if they're hanging onto my octo/primary whatever, I can pull his dump valve. Heck, I'll hit him in that face if need be to get him to let go. But if he's on a 7' hose I could be in trouble. But again, not an issue for DIR buddies. You can swim on a buddy on a short hose, it's just not as easy.

Jerald, I and several other instructors in my area teach OW students on this gear. I assume every time every time I take OW students diving that they are actively trying to kill me. It doesn't prevent me from using a long hose ... nor do I imagine that I would ever have to resort to hitting someone in the face because of how they respond. It's been said several times now ... a long hose does not prevent you from holding another diver's BCD strap. Quite the contrary ... it gives you more options.

Every dive and every diver are different ... things that happen will be situational, and how you respond will depend on the situation.

Based on your responses, I would say forget about the gear for now ... get into a Rescue class and learn how to deal with these situations. Then you won't have to worry about it.

And FWIW - if someone decides to take off on you, pulling a dump valve won't do jack. The air in their BCD will most likely be expanding faster than the dump valve can release it anyway. You will want more options. Being within arm's reach of a panicked diver is a two-edged sword ... because they are also within arm's reach of you, and can do you real damage while you're fiddling around trying to reach a dump valve.

I've had my share of OOA and LOA situations ... and in every case I was glad to have the greater options afforded by the longer hose ... and none of them were in a cave or a wreck.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Soggy]

We haven't had a good knock-down-drag-out brawl about DIR in a couple weeks, so we're overdue to rehash everything all over again for a few hundred posts until we all burn out...

Lamont, after seeing your avatar for so long, I actually picture you looking like Steve Colbert. I'm going to be very surprised if I ever meet you!

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Lamont, after seeing your avatar for so long, I actually picture you looking like Steve Colbert. I'm going to be very surprised if I ever meet you!

Actually, he looks more like Cartman from South Park ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Soggy]

Actually, he looks more like Cartman from South Park ...

Screw you guys, I'm going home...

I wish...actually I have another 2 hours of hell ("work") to do. Good thing I have threads like this to keep me entertained!

 

[lamont]

Lamont, after seeing your avatar for so long, I actually picture you looking like Steve Colbert. I'm going to be very surprised if I ever meet you!

Yes you will... =)

 

[lamont]

Actually, he looks more like Cartman from South Park ...

I HATE HIPPIES!

BEEFCAKE!!! BEEFCAKE!!!

 

[jeraldjcook]

Why do I need to grab their fin just because the hose is longer? You aren't making any sense and you aren't paying attention. The length of the hose does not prevent you from grabbing their harness!!!!! It's not like, because the hose is 7' long (or 5' if you want to use in OW) that I'm going to make you (or allow you to) swim 7' away from me, especially in OW.

Example: During the deep dive while getting my advanced we had a diver [who was questionable to begin with] who at 75ft signaled OOA and bolted for the surface. The DM was right there and gave him his octo and the guy kept on going for the surface. The DM dumped his air and the air in the other guy's BC and kept him down until he calmed. With a short hose, if the OOA diver bolts the DM was still in a position to dump air. And if he is not in a position to dump air it mean the OOA diver dropped the octo. If the DM was unable to hang on and had a long hose, there is no way for him to dump the air, only pull him down by the fins.

And yes, a good tug might free you octo from his mouth, but not if he had a death grip on the hose.

If it could possible happen, it will eventually will happen.

 

[matt_unique]

...otherwise we might think it's about a minority of jerks who think they are all knowing after a DIRF course and 100 lifetime dives and speak condescendingly over the internet (but not in person)....hey wait a minute!

Ha ha ha - you know this is an old an inevitable topic thread...any group that pushes their way as the best without respecting alternative methods loose respect and credibility. This is not exclusive to the DIR crew of course.

--Matt

 

[TheRedHead]

Actually, he looks more like Cartman from South Park ...

Jeez, you just ruined all the single women divers' fantasies....

I assume his legs bend at the knees so he can at least frog kick.

 

[boulderjohn]

Aside from Scubaboard (a place to discuss and make diving safer), where have you experienced this attitude that you seem to know so much about?

Interesting point.

If the only thing you knew about diving was what you read in scubaboard, you would assume that a huge percentage of divers were DIR. After serveral hundreds of dives (I know that isn't all that much) in about 20 states and countries, I have direct experience with only two people (that I know of) with any sort of DIR experience. In fact, I have only seen fewer than 10 divers use a BP/W. (I guess it all isn't as widespread as some people might think.)

One part of my experience was a DIR-trained diver I met via ScubaBoard and buddied with on a memorable day in Florida last spring. He was a wonderful diver and a very nice guy. I would be happy to dive with him again, and I hope he feels the same.

The other is a friend who has just recently begun the training. We went through IE together and often work together. He has told me some of what he has been learning, and it sounds pretty impressive. I would not mind obtaining the skills he is getting, and I sure wish I could frog kick the way the aforementioned buddy can.

Everything else I know about DIR is, indeed, from reading posts in ScubaBoard, and I don't ever go into the DIR forum. I have just watched as an interested observer, and I have never before made a DIR-related post. Perhaps I can make something reasonably close to an objective observation related to the original question, at least as it relates to the ScubaBoard portion of the DIR world.

I think the prejudice against DIR comes, as others have suggested, from some (absolutely not all) posters who really do display the "we are better than everyone else" attitude. I really don't have any strong feelings here, and my only personal experiences have been positive, but even I get annoyed by it.

Sometimes it's subtle. You are reading a thread that has absolutely nothing to do with anything remotely related to DIR, and suddenly up will come a post that in some way refers to the poster's DIR credentials. I wonder what the purpose of the post was. It reminds me of the old Chevy Chase line in his Saturday Night Line Days: "Hi. I'm DIR, and you're not." No big deal, but after a while, it starts to get to you.

It isn't just DIR, though. There are some other people with other "minority" affiliations that take every opportunity to let you know that you are not as good as they are, often with sarcastic rips.

Personally, I try to be as amiable as I can, and I try to get along. Like a lot of people, I don't like being told that I am inferior just because I am not like them. I try to ignore it, but it is not exactly fun reading.

It's difficult to summarize what I am trying (and, I sense, failing) to say. I think that there are some people who adopt a non-mainstream approach to diving (and really anything in life, like a new religion) and then zealously try to rub it in other people's faces. Some of those people are DIR, and some of them are in other areas. In general, when they do it, the rest of the people don't like it. Unfortunately, the result is a resentment against the many fine people who are also in that group but are more restrained in their advocacy.