DIR- GUE Is it worth taking Fundamentals this late in the game?

[PEDiver]

As a little background on myself, I've been diving for 11+ years (originally certified through PADI). About 5 years ago, I went down the non-GUE tech path through TDI and IANTD and did Intro to Tech > AN/DP > Trimix > Intro/Full Cave. When I started down this path, I really had no idea what GUE was outside of a few snide remarks from my instructor.

Regardless, I've done all my training in BM and to this day dive pretty exclusively in BM (outside of a few instances where the cave dictates SM). I'm a very curious person naturally, and so during this period, I talked to quite a few people about DIR, read a lot about DIR (mainly online resources and the Fundamentals of Better Diving by JJ), and was lucky enough to become good friends with someone I would consider a mentor who is a GUE diver and cave diving buddy. So, needless to say, over the years, I've adopted DIR principals and methodology even though I was never "formally" trained in it by a DIR-affiliated agency like GUE.

While that's all and good, the thought of taking GUE training has been growing in my mind recently, even though I feel like I would be going backwards from where I am today. I do really like the organization's training practices and standards (after seeing some less than optimal training through other agencies) and my thought process is, I know I can learn more and continue to hone my skills (which at the end of the day is the most important part to me). I also would love to get involved in GUE projects and/or other affiliated organizations like WKPP (which isn't exclusive to GUE but it obviously has significant overlap).

With all that being said, back to my original question: is it worth taking Fundamentals this late in the game? Has anyone been down a similar path? I know it's an investment of time and money, but the tradeoff could very well be worth it. Would love to hear some thoughts!

 

[Tracy]

I was a technical instructor, trimix rebreather, full cave diver when I took it.
I was disgusted with how many little tweaks I learned in the course.
It wasn't life changing, but it was eye opening on several things. I would recommend you take it with an open mind.

 

[Kendall Raine]

As a little background on myself, I've been diving for 11+ years (originally certified through PADI). About 5 years ago, I went down the non-GUE tech path through TDI and IANTD and did Intro to Tech > AN/DP > Trimix > Intro/Full Cave. When I started down this path, I really had no idea what GUE was outside of a few snide remarks from my instructor.

Regardless, I've done all my training in BM and to this day dive pretty exclusively in BM (outside of a few instances where the cave dictates SM). I'm a very curious person naturally, and so during this period, I talked to quite a few people about DIR, read a lot about DIR (mainly online resources and the Fundamentals of Better Diving by JJ), and was lucky enough to become good friends with someone I would consider a mentor who is a GUE diver and cave diving buddy. So, needless to say, over the years, I've adopted DIR principals and methodology even though I was never "formally" trained in it by a DIR-affiliated agency like GUE.

While that's all and good, the thought of taking GUE training has been growing in my mind recently, even though I feel like I would be going backwards from where I am today. I do really like the organization's training practices and standards (after seeing some less than optimal training through other agencies) and my thought process is, I know I can learn more and continue to hone my skills (which at the end of the day is the most important part to me). I also would love to get involved in GUE projects and/or other affiliated organizations like WKPP (which isn't exclusive to GUE but it obviously has significant overlap).

With all that being said, back to my original question: is it worth taking Fundamentals this late in the game? Has anyone been down a similar path? I know it's an investment of time and money, but the tradeoff could very well be worth it. Would love to hear some thoughts!

Define "worth it." If you're curious why not? It can't hurt you. Only you can decide whether it was worth it and only then after you take it.

My situation was similar to yours but over longer time scales (diving >50 years, TMX >30 years, cave>25 years). Asked my primary dive biddy, who was then a GUE tech instructor, whether it was worth it for me. He said no. Single data point.

 

[Lorenzoid]

@rddvet

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

As a little background on myself, I've been diving for 11+ years (originally certified through PADI). About 5 years ago, I went down the non-GUE tech path through TDI and IANTD and did Intro to Tech > AN/DP > Trimix > Intro/Full Cave. When I started down this path, I really had no idea what GUE was outside of a few snide remarks from my instructor.

Regardless, I've done all my training in BM and to this day dive pretty exclusively in BM (outside of a few instances where the cave dictates SM). I'm a very curious person naturally, and so during this period, I talked to quite a few people about DIR, read a lot about DIR (mainly online resources and the Fundamentals of Better Diving by JJ), and was lucky enough to become good friends with someone I would consider a mentor who is a GUE diver and cave diving buddy. So, needless to say, over the years, I've adopted DIR principals and methodology even though I was never "formally" trained in it by a DIR-affiliated agency like GUE.

While that's all and good, the thought of taking GUE training has been growing in my mind recently, even though I feel like I would be going backwards from where I am today. I do really like the organization's training practices and standards (after seeing some less than optimal training through other agencies) and my thought process is, I know I can learn more and continue to hone my skills (which at the end of the day is the most important part to me). I also would love to get involved in GUE projects and/or other affiliated organizations like WKPP (which isn't exclusive to GUE but it obviously has significant overlap).

With all that being said, back to my original question: is it worth taking Fundamentals this late in the game? Has anyone been down a similar path? I know it's an investment of time and money, but the tradeoff could very well be worth it. Would love to hear some thoughts!

I know a few cave divers locally and from across the border who took it who found it helpful. It wasn't life changing, but there were things that they did find beneficial. I can't speak for them obviously. I'll ask one who is on SB to chime in.

 

[TheBeepBoop]

Whether it’s worth it or not is up to you. I don’t have nearly as much experience as you but want to go down the tech path and found the course to be amazing.

In your case I bet you could contact a local GUE instructor and talk with them. Maybe even see if they would just be a buddy on a dive with you. Unlike what a handful of people think on here, the GUE folks are really very nice and always willing to go out and dive, even if it just to practice skills or do a shallow rec dive.

 

[steinbil]

I'm not in a position to really answer your question, as you have much more experience than I do, but I think knowing what you want from it would be good to define.

If you want to get "in" with GUE, taking the class would be a way in, with the added benefit of maybe learning something, getting some good feedback.

If you want to learn, maybe? It's possible that you are super squared away and have learned what you need from your GUE buddy, reading and experience. Still if you find a really good instructor, of which there seems to be plenty, you'll probably learn something. I mean, there's always something to learn. I think the major new thing for really good divers coming to GUE from the outside is the team mentality, even out of the water.

If you want more GUE training down the road, you need to qualify somehow, so it would be an obvious choice.

I'd suggest getting in touch with a GUE instructor. All the instructors I've been in contact with have been super helpful, and they could give you an idea of your options. Maybe they would suggest a dive together to see where you're at and take it from there...

 

[broncobowsher]

I've been looking at this more and more. Doing wrecks in a rebreather and learning that my instruction path wasn't the greatest. I was trying to research out the right path to take. I did succeed in getting down the path. But looking back, I'm not far off a functional train wreck. I've never had bail out hanging right. Got a little help once, things were a lot better, for a few dives. Then I got something wrong and don't know what I screwed up. Back to my original training. I know it is wrong, but I have not found what it takes to fix it. There is a bunch of little stuff like that. I know it should be better, but have not found what it takes. I've been looking at a fundies class just to clean up the basics. I hear they are good. My biggest would be how far back do I need to go?

 

[Underwater Tourist]

If it makes no difference to you financially, then I don't see any reason not to do it.

Worst case you gain nothing.

Best case you gain something.

It is a pretty good outcome tree.

 

[SpeedyJ]

I did a bunch of tech certs though other agencies and then went back and did some through GUE. Every class has taught me something new, and every time I am at my preferred dive center in Mexico, there is at least one student there who has a bunch of training/certification taking a GUE class that they already have a card for from another agency. They all seem to be finding value in it too - especially as I see a lot of them end up taking the whole offering.

What's the worst that can happen? You spend 4-5 days in the water with a great instructor who says "Yep, you're a total rockstar, I can offer you nothing." How likely do you think that is?