Why is DIR controversial?

[lamont]

But if "DIR" means "doing it right" then you have already said they are not doing it right.
Which is it?
Does DIR mean "doing it right" or not?
Make up your mind.
To sit there and demand that everyone else understand that "DIR" means "doing it right" but "not DIR" doesn't mean "not doing it right" is ridiculous. You guys are off in la la land to think that makes any sense at all, and to fail to see that you're putting everyone else down by the use of the term is denial of almost pathological immensity.
Change the name or admit you're arrogant elitists. You can't have it both ways.
Rick

Yeah, actually I can. You can't allow me to have it both ways, but that's your problem.

I dive DIR, I don't care what the label originally meant back in some rant that GI3 wrote back before I ever decided to become a diver. I dive DIR because I dive and train with other DIR divers, and I do so because they've got a system which I can see will take me where I want to go. That's it. The rest of it is all in your head, not in mine.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

 

[rjack321]

OTOH, I think it is sad that this agency does not offer training to a broader audience due to equipment bias that is somewhat pointless for most recreational divers.

Why on earth should they try and train you in equipment they as instructors don't know how to use, configure, or manage (its failures)?

They train you in a specific set of equipment because the skills, teamwork and equipment work together. Having some but not all of the pieces is suboptimal and they want you to be the best diver you can be, not hamstrung only having 2 legs on a 3 legged stool.

 

[TSandM]

A lot of the "rules" boil down to one of three things:

Either something is deemed to be inherently unsafe or involve too much risk (heavy steel tanks without redundant buoyancy), or

There are a number of equally safe approaches but one has been chosen for consistency, or

A particular piece of equipment or way of doing things has been chosen with an eye to how it fits in much further down the line.

The last one is the one where many people argue that the DIR prescriptions are irrelevant or unnecessary for the open water rec diver. And I think there is probably some truth to that. But the whole idea of DIR is that one MAY want to go on (and, in fact, probably will eventually want to go on) and it's easier not to have to change anything if you do.

Oh, and by the way, for those who may not know this . . . DIR does grow and change. In fact, there is now a place on the GUE website for people to go and find out what the changes have been, because there are a lot of us out there who learned things the way we were taught, and have been frustrated at not having an easy way to keep up with the evolution.

 

[lamont]

If someone wants to drag a particular DIR item (one that may be controversial in and of itself) out into an open forum, for discussion on its merits rather than its "DIRness," then you'll see the challenges appear that are absent here because of the special rules.

You'll find that most of us do read the basic scuba discussion forum, the hogarthian forum and the rest of the forums on this board where we engage in all the endless discussions about long hoses in open water, BP/Ws, hose lengths and bungee wings. This idea that we hide around in the DIR forum because we're afraid of having our methods questioned outside of our safe space is kind of amusing... I just did a title search on "pony" of my posts and found 21 threads, only 1 of them was in the DIR forum...

 

[lamont]

NO! I prefer to screw up on my own and learn from my own mistakes (if I live long enough).

For the kind of diving I'm doing, enough people have died figuring things out that I'm inclined to learn from those who came before me.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I also think Lynne has a great point that some of the most arrogant egotistical divers tend to migrate to DIR – whether they last or not I don’t know.

I've met arrogant, egotistical divers who were trained by GUE.
I've met arrogant, egotistical divers who were trained by NAUI Tech.
I've met arrogant, egotistical divers who were trained by IANTD.

And the most arrogant, egotistical diver I have ever met is a PADI Master Instructor who's been teaching since regulators were invented, doesn't know squat beyond recreational level diving, and hasn't learned anything new in at least 40 years.

Why waste time getting worked up by any of them? It ain't worth the effort ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[lamont]

And the open forums are positively filled with sound arguments for "other than 'DIR' " ways and things.
Maybe I'm missing your point
Rick

And if all the DIR divers only read those different forums we'd change our ways and stop diving DIR and pissing you off? Maybe you should make it a little easier to find the basic scuba discussion forum or the tanks and bands forum on scubaboard because I'm a little bit slow with computers and never seem to see those threads... The admins should stop hiding them away from the public...

 

[*Floater*]

DIR is the only scuba philosophy of it's kind that I can think of with a sizable following. If there was another one with a passionate and internet savvy group of advocates, then I'm sure it would be just as controversial. For example, if the NE wreck divers had advanced their favorite dive practices and gear configurations into general sport, deco and overhead environment diving with strictness, started their own agency based on these principles and went around the internet giving advice in good faith based on their beliefs then I'm sure you'd get the same reaction. People just like to debate stuff and sometimes it gets heated. DIR is an easy target since it's so specific on equipment and dive practices.

 

[lamont]

I'm also NOT DIR trained, I did however adopt their configuration for a cold water BP/W setup as it works well for me. I dive it with Splits! :mooner:

But DIR is that Narrow, try a Wing with Bungies in a DIRF class. Try diving Steel without redundant buoyancy controls. DIR has very specific and narrow rules about what is and is not DIR.

I have no bias against DIR trained divers, and find a lot of the concepts (most of which are not things they invented) sound. I dive with and respect many DIR trained divers. OTOH, I think it is sad that this agency does not offer training to a broader audience due to equipment bias that is somewhat pointless for most recreational divers.

GUE exists to train divers up to tech 2 and/or cave 2. It doesn't exist to train recreational divers. They do have on paper a recreational OW course, but we've still never seen anyone with a GUE OW c-card show up and that whole thing is very much like watching a pig attempting to sing.